I am an architect/artist who has some b+w experience. I love b+w photography. However, working on my own, i get overwhelmed with the photographic possibilities in the everyday world. Could someone suggest a list or book that might describe interesting subjects, assignments or arrangements that i might sink my teeth into?

I have been carrying my camera back and forth for the past month but have photographed very little. Do the pros set out for a deliberate subject or do they hope for "inspiration" just driving or walking around? Do they feel subconcious stopping on a busy highway to photograph an old abandoned car? Please help

-- william j. means (meanburl@aol.com), December 17, 1997

Answers

Response to B&W Photo: Creativity, Etc.

This might sound trite but, photograph what is important to YOU. There are numerous books out there with all sorts of IDEAS to photograph. But what I have found is that often times you end up photographing someone else's ideas and end up with nice photos that look like they were taken by someone else. Start with what you know. You mentioned architecture. What is it you like/dislike about it? How does it make you feel? Does it affect you in a way that you would somehow like to express to others?

This is where to begin to look for possibilities. Pros often do set out for a specific subject; they're are often paid to do that. Some are lucky enough to even enjoy the subject matter they are paid to shoot. The nice thing about your situation is that you can shoot what is important to you.

I think you mean, do they feel "self-conscious". Of course they might be subconscious too. Anyway, do it anyway. Worst that usually happens is that someone stops and says "what are ya doin', takin' a picture?" Then just smile and say "nope, just lookin' through the back of this here black box."

-- Jef Torp (JefTorp@aol.com), December 17, 1997.

heres one technique i use when i go out "shooting". i have several subjects that interest me, ice, steps of buildings, trees along the rivers etc. i concentrate on finding these things, while looking at everything. by not trying to figure out how to take a picture of everything that you see, you can begin to build a body of work around a more limited number of subjects. i have found that by narrowing my field, i begin to produce series of pictures that relate to the same subject. this makes your presentation look more professional and less hap hazard. jef is right when he says to pick a subject that means something to you, but dont hesitate to abandon it if it starts to go no where for you. ultimately you are the most important judge of what is good and bad in your photography, do it to please yourself and i think you will find that no one is harder to please that you are. if you are having trouble settling on subjects, then try to determine what you want to see in a picture and look for those types of subjects. i shoot large format and spend a lot of time setting the image up on the ground glass, and am as likely as not, to pick the camera up and move to a new location without ever having exposed a sheet of film. become very critical of what you put on film and you will find that the subjects that you do capture will begin to have more life to them than you thought they could have. at the same time when you are starting out on a project such as this it is probably better to go ahead and take the pictures you see and then learn from your prints what is going to work and what isnt. these are just some things i do that help me, i hope maybe one f them might help you decide which direction to go. good luck!

-- MTHOMPSON (MTHOMPSON@CLINTON.NET), December 18, 1997.

interesting BW subjects

Whatever you do, do it with a passion. Jump in and leave your self consciousness at home. When a photographer is working, working hard, with a camera and a subject, completely absorbed in that subject, lost in that space between camera, film and subject, the photographer dances. Do a little dance, make a little love.... Let them stare. Two techniques: Take thousands of pictures of everything, take many images of the same thing. then study the proof sheets and find the one that works best. Film is cheap. Expose film, bracket, trip the shutter over and over. Practice practice. Edit at home, find the gold among the dross later. The other technique: Go out with two exposures. Study, compose, test for correct exposures and then carefully make just two exposures per day, or per week or whatever, but make them the best you possibly can. Then make beautiful prints. Two techniques, each may work at different times for different photographers. Good luck.

-- Jim ryder (Jimryder12@aol.com), December 18, 1997.

I think you've already answered your question by admitting that you see possibilities everywhere. All that you must do is to stop, look through the veiwfinder and release the shutter. If you feel self-conscious about photographing in public (many of us do) then go somewhere where there are few people or try it again on another day when the inspiration overpowers you. You can't be told, or advised, what to photograph...it just happens. In the immortal words of the Nike Corporation "Just Do It".

-- Andy Laycock (aglay@interchange.ubc.ca), December 18, 1997.

I presume that when you say 'carrying my camera back and forth' you mean between work and home, or wherever your daily life takes you. I find that although I almost always have a camera with me, my best shots -- and best 'shooting' times -- come from an intentional photo 'session'. In my case, that means a few hours on a slow day, good enough weather to walk (works better for me than driving), and nothing to rush to later. This gives me enough inspiration to open up to scenes that I might otherwise never see, or at least never spend the time to photograph. I will often just walk around my neighborhood; it gives me a certain focus (so to speak).

-- John Labovitz (johnl@meer.net), December 18, 1997.

Firstly, I would personally like to thank Jef Torp, MThompson, Jim Ryder, Andy Laycock and John Labovitz for your words of encouragement and ideas in response to my question. All your ideas have forced me to narrow my subject ideas to things that really interest me (as suggested by J. Torp). I was especially inspired by J. Ryder's idea of shooting alot of film then shooting just a couple of well composed images. Thank you all for your support.

What i have discovered from this self examination is that i am really interested and excited by images of "things" in various stages of decay, ie.. delapitated buildings, walls, boats, abandoned cars, peeling paint, ect.. The disparity between inanimate objects (broken fences, stone walls, old barns) and living things (vines, ivy, overgrowth) is also an exciting topic. The beauty of these images is thier ability to convey the passage of time. One can infer what was, what is, and what is to come. I don't believe this subject is macabre but rather are examples of the life cycle - birth, life, death, rebirth. To me , this has endless possibilities and is a beautiful allegory.

Now that i think i'm on the right track, I have a few more questions. To the more experienced photographers mentioned above (and any others who would like to comment) does this photo subject idea seem like a good place to start? If so, is there any type of mail-in critique available to photographers working alone, someone who could comment on composition, content and presentation? What kind of 35mm lens(s) would you recommend for this type of work?

Thanking you in advance for your time and advice.

-- william j. means (meanburl@aol.com), December 20, 1997.

response to interesting subjects

The "Photoforum" web site has a gallery. About 6-8 people post there per week. Other participants comment both privately and publicly. A lot of it is digital stuff. There seems to be all levels of expertise represented. I don't know what kind of lens but look at the work of Aaron Siskind. He did peeling paint better than anyone. But don't look at reproductions, find original prints.His images loose almost everything when they are repoduced. His work requires silver. He was a master black and white printer. The only photographer I know of who developed his film by sight using green light. To get just the right density. Black and white at a different level. Simply beautiful tone. He did peeling paint in black and white. Great stuff

-- jim Ryder (jimryder12@aol.com), December 22, 1997.

response

William writes in part:

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William, your insights into what this subject mean to you show that you already posses the ability to "see" what you want to reproduce. Composition "is the strongest way of seeing." (Edward Weston) Most books on composition, IMHO, are pretty lacking in any really useful information. The only exception, again IMHO, is The Art of Photography by Bruce Barnbaum. It is the only book that deals with the reasons you compose a photograph in the first place; because you feel something. Feeling something comes directly from who you are and what is important to you.

The best advice I can give with regards to composition is SIMPLIFY. Decide what you want your photograph to say and put nothing in the photograph that detracts from that message. Much easier said than done. Good luck and happy hunting.

-- Jef Torp (JefTorp@aol.com), December 23, 1997.

Is photography art??/Rusting bolt??

Jeff, its interesting that you mention Bruce Barnbaums book, "The Art of Photography", because I believe he addresses, succinctly, this ongoing issue, as well as the topic of realism ( rusty bolt) versus abstraction.

First, his basic theme is that the one rule in photography is that there are no rules!!! Thus, it is perfectly okay to manipulate an image (say, make it out of focus) in order to create a special feeling for the observer. Strict adherence to the technical aspects of photography is fine, if thats what one is attempting, yet, in no way is this "better" photography. Indeed, in either case, realism or abstraction, it is important that the photo stimulate an emotional response. This is what makes it art, just as a fine painting or sculpture can have a visceral impact.

Yet according to Barnbaum, .. a good composition alone, does not imply fine art. A great number of photographers can produce exquisite photographs that say nothing and inspire nobody. (Bart:including the photographer!) He continues, There is an abundance of photographs that are technically perfect but devoid of meaning. As Ansel Adams once said,  there is nothing more useless than a sharp photograph of a fuzzy concept .

If the rusty bolt elicits an emotional response from the person who photographed it, great! And if others also enjoy ones work, even better. There are no rules to achieve this!! Yet, if all the techniques and manipulation fails to achieve any emotion, it is not art.

-- Barton Lund (bal1210@sprynet.com), December 25, 1997.

William, Build a web page. There are several places that offer free web site space and it can be fun building a web site. Place "free web pages" in a search engine and you will find most of them.

Then your photography will be exposed to the world and you can have a comment and suggestion section on your site. Good Luck.

-- Dell Elzey (potog@mindspring.com), December 21, 1997.

The most recent issue of "Lensowk Quarterly" includes an essay by Bill Jay, and another person whose name I can't remember now, on the topic of choosing what to photograph. I'm paraphrasing the essay from memory, but Jay suggests the following process for choosing the topic of a photographic exploration:

1) Make a list of everything you are interested in. Carry around a small notebook for a while. If you think of something interesting, write it down. Any topic.

2) From this list, eliminate things which are not visual. [my examples, not Jay's] Jazz film scores, photographic criticism, whatever.

3) Also from the list, eliminate things which are not accessable. I enjoy visiting shrines and temples in Japan. There are no Japanese shrines in Denver, so it might be a poor choice for a photo project.

4) [here my memory is getting a bit fuzzy] From the remaining items, pick something that you know well. It's much easier to transfer depth of knowledge to deep images, than shallow knowledge. This, of course, could be taken to mean "if you don't know your topic well, do a lot of research BEFORE picking up a camera".

5) If there are still more than one item on the list, pick the one which you think OTHERS would be most interested in seeing. [my notes] Pick something your intended audience would be most interested in seeing.

I think your intended audience is very important. Is it just yourself? Immediate family or friends? Artists organization? General Public? Subject matter, and choice or presentation should change depending on your intended audience.

Anyway, I hope the filter of my memory hasn't mangled Mr. Jay's ideas too much. Check out the full essay (it's written in the form of an "interview", but it's really more of a collaborative essay by two authors) in Lenswork Quarterly. LWQ is not always easy to find, but just last week, I found it (for the first time!) at Barnes & Noble in Boulder Colorado.

-- Mike Rosenlof (rosenlof@qualcomm.com), December 22, 1997.

a well defined subject is the perfect place to start. you asked questions and listened carefully to all of the answers and suggestions that were offered to you, then made an intellegent decision on what course of action to take, congratulations! i can't really address the critique part of your follow up, it is tough to find good, honest feed back on your work. i am lucky to have a few friends in photography who will give me an honest and fair appraisal of my work, even if it sometimes isn't what i want to hear. as to lenses, i would suggest and exercise. take a subject, lets say a building, and photograph the entire structure with the widest lens that you have. then take the entire building with the longest lens that you have. now take pictures of anything on the building that interests you, with any focal length that you want, tele shots, wide angle, and close up shots, but record what focal length you use for each frame. i would suggest that you plan on using at least a roll of film for this exercise and take only one picture of each subject. you want to have as much information available when you get the pictures processed. now, for a given subject, you will have a record of all of the focal lengths available to you. do this for as many subjects that you want and you will begin to see that you prefer a given set of focal lengths. personnally i tend to look at subjects in focal lengths. by that i mean, i like the "look" of the wide angle 18 to 28 mm. they give me a looming foreground and great depth of field. so when i look at a subject i decide whether it will present itsself in that wide angle format. i also find that a lot of my work is in an area where a short tele 60 to 75mm is used, but the only way to develope these "preferences" is to shoot a lot of pictures with a lot of focal lengths.

-- MTHOMPSON (MTHOMPSON@CLINTON.NET), December 22, 1997.

Lens Choice

I think that next to film, lens choice is the most critical choice you can make in a photograph. Lens focal lengths can have a very dramatic effect on the look of a photograph and therefore need to be used wisely. Here are some basics to consider:

"Normal Lens" - These, roughly speaking, give the same view on film as our own eyes do. They basically recreate "reality" as our eyes would see it. Often times a very appropriate choice. Reality is, after all, pretty amazing.

"Wide Angle Lens" - These lenses have an angle of view that is wider than "Normal." The primary characteristic that these lenses possess is that they expand spatial relationships. If something is right next to you and you put on a wide angle lens, the object will appear farther away than normal. This expansion applies to the background as well. Thus it appears smaller and further away. Since the foreground is not as far away, it appears to loom. These lenses always put more visual emphasis on the foreground than on the background, whether you want that to happen or not. This does not, however, mean that the point of your photograph is necessarily in the foreground. These lenses also create strong converging lines. All of this can be good if used to lead the viewer to the point of the photograph. They can be devastating to a photograph if used improperly.

"Telephoto Lenses" - Yes, you guessed it, longer than "normal" and they also compress spatial relationships. The effects of this lens are basically the opposite of the wide angle lenses.

My philosophy - Choose a lens based on what effect you want in your photograph. Then move your camera position to frame the subject based on you original response. Too many people stand in one place and use lens focal length to frame their subject without giving any regard to the visual distortion that is occuring as a result.

I agree that you can shoot a lot of pictures to see what you like. I also think that you can do the same thing by seriously studying the viewfinder before you make the exposure. Ask yourself whether or not the visual characteristics of the lens choice you have made have the effect on your final composition that your looking for.

Well, I rambled on and on, probably started a war based on my views of lens choice, and ended the previous sentence in a prepostion. I wonder what tomorrow will bring?

Cheers!

-- Jef Torp (JefTorp@aol.com), December 23, 1997.

Word choice

You also used 'your' instead of 'you're' Jef! Tsk, tsk. It's lucky that you give good advice. Merry Christmas everyone.

-- Andy Laycock (aglay@interchange.ubc.ca), December 23, 1997.

Word Choice

Aaaagh!! I've been found out. Maybe it's a deep psychosomatic problem from my childhood, my father was an English teacher. Maybe I have found the answer to the question "why do I photograph." Thanks Andy, it's nice to be kept honest.

-- Jef Torp (JefTorp@aol.com), December 23, 1997.

lense choice

Jeff, nice piece on lenses. So now I gather that wide lenses are wide, normal lenses are normal, and long lenses are long, right? Now can you fill me in on short, intermediate, and long term corporate bonds ? My stock broker couldn't explain it to me.

-- john schulz (johnschulz@mindspring.com), December 28, 1997.

If you are interested in photographing architectural subjects, a good tool is a perspective control lens to get all the vertical lines straight and avoid convergence. Nikon makes 35 mm & 28 mm PC lenses and Canon make 2 or 3 tilt & shift lenses. Also Olympus make a 24mm shift lens. Also required is a camera with interchangable viewing screens so you can insert a grid screen to help line up your subjects. I got hold of a used Nikon 35 PC and used it for a couple of years before adding the 28 PC. Experiment with different filters and film. Infra red film works well with many architectural subjects. Julius Shulman is a master at architectural subjects. His 1977 book "The Photography of Architecture and Design", Whitney Press may still be available. Good luck!

-- John R. Fowler (cpci@fox.nstn.ca), December 28, 1997.

...feeling "sort of stupid" (which I do when taking pictures of old things) doesn't feel so "sort of stupid" when I turn on the lights in the darkroom and see the print in the fixer. As you go out there to photograph just smile at the nice people and humm along with the world.

-- Peter Thoshinsky (camerabug1@msn.com), December 29, 1997.

All respondants have been bringing up some very good tips and points. I have been using them all to some degree in my recent photos.

I have found myself driving around literally for hours on sundays to photograph. I waste more time in the car then with the camera. Would it be more advisable to concentrate on one location and one theme? I often think to myself while i'm out shooting what kind of pictures a pro would be taking if he (or she) were there with me. What do they see that i don't?

oh well, better fill my tank and get ready for sunday.

thanks everyone.

bill means

-- william j. means (meanburl@aol.com), December 30, 1997.

What pros see

Bill,

A substantial amount of photography for me is driving/walking around. I very rarely ever go out with a specific idea of something to shoot unless someone else is paying for my time. While concentration on one location or a theme can be recommended, it isn't a pancea for what ails you. What ails you, IMO for what it's worth, is a lack of faith in your own vision and emotional responses. This is very common in people who are struggling with the idea of "what do I shoot?"

The "pros" don't see anything better than you do, they just see it through their own eyes and mentallity. Which often translates to "what is the most appropriate photograph to take of this scene to make it saleable." It doesn't sound to me, from your posts, that this is your motivation for photographing the world around you.

If you go to one specific location to photograph you will probably end up with a higher quantity of images than if you drive around all day. The real question though is, are they better more meaningful images. I can't answer that question for you. Only advice I can give has been around for thousands of years.....To thine own self be true.

Happy Shooting

-- Jef Torp (JefTorp@aol.com), December 31, 1997.

What to do

If by 'pros' you mean well-known fine art photographers (as opposed to commercial photographers) then they have photographed in every way possible: by car, foot, boat, their kitchen widows, camel etc. etc. I am not a pro but for the last year I have been starting at one location, every Saturday, downtown and just heading off in whatever direction I feel like walking that day and just photographing whatever catches my interest. Even going over the same terrain on a different day I will see something that I missed previously. I have finally reached my limit and will need to change my habits but I know someone who has been doing this same thing for 10 years and he still produces some great work every week. I found that driving around without at least a small commitement to a destination was frustrating since it is hard to see hidden treasure from a car. However, having said that, some fantastic works of art have been produced from a moving car ie Robert Frank. Hope this helps.

-- Andy Laycock (aglay@interchange.ubc.ca), January 01, 1998.

Again, I have received some vey useful and practical information from the people who have taken time to answer my post.

Jef Torp and Andy Laycock suggested I concentrate on one location rather than driving around aimlessly. Well, this suggestion worked. I went to a small historic town on the banks of the Hudson River in NY and spent 4 hours taking photos. There were many opportunities to shoot the decaying theme i have been after in the side streets and back alleys. By concentrating on one location, I found myself "seeing" many more possible images.

Unfortunately, the next day i went to a different location and was not inspired by anything i saw. I guess certain places are "richer" than others in terms of images. Does this happen often with you more experienced photographers?

Anybody have any of thier own interesting b+w posted anywhere? I would like some inspiration.

thanks again in advance.

bill

-- william j. means (meanburl@aol.com), January 05, 1998.

For richer of poorer

Bill,

I have often gone to locations that I thought were "richer" and others that I thought were poorer, only to go back to both and have completely the opposite response. Some days we as human beings are just more open to certain things. Maybe its the hot Thai food we had for lunch, who knows?

I like to go back and back to areas until I feel that I have exhausted all the possible photographic possibilities. Then I wait about a month and go back again. I usually see something else that I never even noticed. Or something has changed in a way that make the scene more fascinating. I usually find that that something is me!

Happy shooting,

Jef

-- Jef Torp (JefTorp@aol.com), January 05, 1998.

A must! Both Mike Rosenlof and Jeff Spirer have given excellent advice by suggesting reading an excerpt from a recent book on subject selection. The book's title is "On Being A Photographer" by David Hurn and Bill Jay. Anybody who is struggling with subject selection or keeping up thier enthusiasm for photographing should read this excerpt. If I would have read this first, I probably would not have had to bother everyone with my incessant babble.

The web address for this excerpt is http://www.teleport.com/~lenswork/onbeingexcerpt.htm

I highly recommend this article. Thanks again Mike and Jeff.

After everybody reads this, I would like to start a discussion thread on the content. Anybody interested?

Bill

-- william j. means (meanburl@aol.com), January 11, 1998.