I don't know where else to post this, but I'm curious if this has happened to anyone else. I never thought it would happen to me.

This afternoon, a lovely fall sunday afternoon in Westchester, I was wondering around the town I've lived in for the past three years, with my Hasselblad and tripod, when a police car pulled up in front of me.

The cops demanded to know where I was from and what I was doing, and they didn't ask it in a nice tone. So I responded in kind. I told them I live in the town they work for, that I was taking pictures of buildings which as far as I was aware was still legal and if they didn't have probable cause, they should move on and find something else to worry about.

By this time, I had attracted a crowd, and an elderly gentleman started yelling at the cops to go find some real criminals. They left with a warning that they would be 'keeping an eye on me'

They more or less followed me slowly in the police car for another half hour. I just calmly set my tripod down, took meter readings, took pictures and moved on.

Has this ever happened to anyone else?

-- David Parmet (dparmet@bestweb.net), October 31, 1999

Answers

More times than I can say. I believe it to be caused by overpopulation, the root of all evil. Too many people too close together causes unsocial behavior and claustrophobic paranoia. Unfortunately it's not just the cops...t

-- tom meyer (twm@mindspring.com), October 31, 1999.

Something similar happened to me a couple of years ago in downtown Boston, although it was a dentally-challenged security guard, not a cop. I was interested in photgraphing the side of a building on a public street and he told me that it was private property. I told him I meant no harm and would have walked on by if there was a sign taht read "Private Property". I asked him to show me where the sign was and he said "can't you take my word for it?". I was feeling punchy so I said "no, I prefer to see a sign...."

Anyway, I think modern society has acquired a higher degree of paranoia and therefore is suspicious of anyone with a camera. The Diana incident dind't help matters either, regardless of where the true irresponsibility existed.

-- Asher (schachter@a1.tch.harvard.edu), October 31, 1999.

I suspect this happens to everyone sooner or later. Ironic that the security people themselves make extensive use of CCTV.

My technique is always to respond with total civility and politeness, while pointing out their mistake. This doesn't usually totally defuse the situation. I am also very careful to appear 'safe', i.e. unarmed. Here in the UK, someone was recently shot dead by the police for carrying a table leg that might have been a shotgun, and I guess a tripod must look even more suspicious.

-- Alan Gibson (Alan.Gibson@technologist.com), November 01, 1999.

This only happens to me in Mexico, where I try not to fail the attitude test. I understand your prickly response, but wonder if a more conciliatory tone might have made the exchange more pleasant for all concerned. If you are really bothered by their treatment of you, you should file a complaint against them. It goes on their record no matter what. Where I live, I think the cops have better things to do.

I've never been a cop-lover, but on the other hand I've rarely been hassled, despite having maintained for most of my life a somewhat radical appearance (long hair, beard, motorcycle). A year or so ago I obtained a concealed-carry permit, and I find that when I'm stopped by a cop and proffer (as required by law) my concealed-carry permit as well as my driver license I am treated with an extra measure of respect. I have already been investigated by Interpol and the FBI and have a known clean record. Then I can discuss the weather with the cops before they return to their job of busting crack and heroin dealers.

-- Ed Buffaloe (edbuffaloe@unblinkingeye.com), November 01, 1999.

During my many years working as a newspaper photojournalist I've been told many times I wasn't allowed to make photos of whatever. I've made it a point to fight (not physically) overzealous cops who try to hide the way they operate by trying to stop me from making photos. After a few years of this, whenever I saw a cop approaching me, and I could usually tell what his intentions were, I would begin making photos of the approaching cop. Fortunately I worked for newspapers who would stand up for me. I've been threatened with arrest many times. I always stood my ground and filed complaints against the cops. I always told young photographers starting out with us to always know exactly what they could and couldn't do and stand their ground and fight the bastards. This is really a sore spot for me. We photographers, whether amature or professional, should always fight for our rights. In 1934 the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that if, in a public place, you could see something, you could legally photograph it. In 1993, I think it was, a photojournalist in Washingto D.C. was arrested for photographing two cops handcuffing a drunk suspect to a parking meter. The photojournalist filed a 151-million dollar lawsuit against the city and police department. They settled out of court with the city and police department apologizing and agreeing to provide media relations training for all officers and future officers. I urge each and every one of you, stand up for your rights.

-- Joe Cole (jcole@apha.com), November 01, 1999.

It's not only the police. About 15 years ago I took a class I was teaching to Fort Point in San Francisco (a national recreational area) on a field trip and we all photographed with no problem even using view cameras. About 4 years ago a friend and I returned to the same place and I set up an antique folding camera on a tripod in the courtyard and immediately a lady ranger rushed out of her office and started questioning me about this unusual camera and informed me that I would have to leave unless I had a permit for commercial photography at that site. My friend with his slr was not questioned although he stood next to me. I was allowed to stay after I explained I was "playing" with an antique camera and wasn't working for a commercial business, but I was watched very carefully.

I think the "too many rats in the cage" theory is correct...we're so jammed together we've become paranoid. Big government snooping into everyone's private lives doesn't help build trust either.

-- Todd Frederick (fredrick@hotcity.com), November 06, 1999.

Part of the problem is people's perception of you and what you are trying to do. I am currently using an EOS Elan and one of the drawbacks of it is that everywhere I go people think I am a newspaper photographer, or some kind of a professional. (I am the type of person who does not want to attract attention when I photograph, and I am seriously considering scraping the logos off my equipment.) Whether their reaction to me is favorable or not depends on whether they want that kind of attention. I once worked for a utility company as an intern, and on my way to work I saw one of their crews at work. I started taking some pictures for the company bulletin. One of the guys rushed over and was very agitated and threatening. After I had explained who I was, he explained that he thought I was with the local newspaper, and that they had some problems with the news photographers (what the problems were I don't remember). He then proceeded to kiss my butt and make nice. Now, I had every right to make the pictures, as I was standing on a public sidewalk and they were working in the street. However, when people feel threatened for whatever reason, they are likely to try to defend themselves, that's human nature. Another time I was standing on a residential street taking a picture of a cat on a garage roof. A lady came out of the house in her bathrobe and asked me what I was doing, partly I think out of curiosity and partly out of concern. For all she knew I could have been a reporter, a real-estate appraiser, or an FBI agent For all I knew they could have had a marijuana-growing operation or a freezer full of body parts. I was a little short in my reply, because I didn't think I needed to justify what I was doing. I wasn't rude, I just wasn't friendly or apologetic. But I understand that people don't like the spotlight pointed at them, even if it's a perceived spotlight. Also, I think it's hard for some people to understand photographers who take pictures of things not for what they are so much as for how they look. I once photographed a piece of toast floating in a mud puddle. Some people just don't see the point of doing that.

So if you're outside somebody's place of business taking a photograph of the facade because of the fantastic late-afternoon sidelighting, but the owner thinks you're the P.I. his wife hired to catch him cheating, then you may be in for an interesting exchange. (Hopefully not gunfire)

So stick up for your rights, but be careful. If you have a legal right to make a picture, but you are shot dead in the process, does it matter that you were in the right?

-- Peter Korsborn (korsborn@gte.net), November 07, 1999.

Could someone post the basic details of the 1934 Supreme Court case? Who were the litigants etc. I can't seem to find it at www.findlaw.com and I'd like a little more information. Thanks.

-- O.M. Jenkins (omjenkins@yahoo.com), November 08, 1999.

You can get that information through the National Press Photographers Association.

-- Joe Cole (jcole@apha.com), November 08, 1999.

I'll share a similar story. Some authoritarian copsuckers harassed me one time because I was pulled over at the side of the street shooting out the window of my vehicle. He pulled in behind me and fired up the bullhorn, "Driver get out and step slowly away from the vehicle with your hands up." I get out after laying my minolta in the passenger seat and put my hands up. A particularly fat cop gets behind me and tells me to get on my knees then frisks me. He tells me to get up then he cuffs me and lays me face-first on a patch of grass on the church property that had been my subject. At that point two other patrol cars swing into the church parking lot and fatty yells to his buddies, "Something on the seat check it out for me.", then presses his shotgun into my back and reminds me to hold still. His buddy holds up my camera to show fatty and chucklingly says, "He,heee it's a camera!" So I'm hauled up off my face and uncuffed and the fat cop then has the gall to lie, "You match a description of a guy we're looking for". YEAH RIGHT! Fox needs a show called "Fat Bored Cops".

-- Trib (linhof6@hotmail.com), November 10, 1999.

I'm _soooo_ glad I don't live in the US. Reminds me of a workmate who had a cop pull a gun on him during a routine traffic stop when he reached for his wallet.

Unfortunately, the rest of the (first) world seems only to be progressing towards such societies, rather than away from them.

btw, if you'd like to scruff up your gear to avoid the 'pro' label, black gaffer tape does wonders.

duncan

-- Duncan McRae (duncanm@zip.com.au), November 10, 1999.

and Duncan, I'm soooo glad I don't live in the UK/Scotland.....I'd be in jail for shooting a clamper.....and as those societies crumble, I'll be locked and loaded...... and you?

-- Trib (linhof6@hotmail.com), November 15, 1999.

Although I'm coming in late on this discussion, I wanted to comment on Todd Frederick's experience at Fort Point. I've been hassled photographing a few places (China Camp near San Rafael, for example). Fort Point, however, is one of my favorite local photography spots. Over the years I photographed there with every type of camera from 35mm to 8x10, and I've never been treated with anything but courtesy by the rangers. I'm sorry Todd had a bad experience, and I hope it doesn't discourage anyone from photographing this wonderful spot.

-- Chris Patti (cmpatti@aol.com), November 15, 1999.

I'll be laid out on the couch watching it all unfold in stupifying surround-technocolour on America's most wanted home video's as the fat cops hound you down with satellites and smart bombs.

-- Duncan (duncanm@zip.com.au), November 15, 1999.

Nice image. And speaking of dumb fat cops, a sequel to my original post. Last weekend I saw the cop involved in the 'incident' in my original post giving the nth degree to some black kid who according to the cop 'didn't look like he belonged in our neighborhood.' Ironically enough, the cop himself is also black.

I told the kid afterwards if he wanted to file a complaint against the cop I'd go doubles with him.

Ah, the suburbs.

-- David Parmet (dparmet@bestweb.net), November 15, 1999.

When I was working as a photojournalist I participated in an exchange program thing in which I went to Russia and spent a week with a Russian photojournalist. We went absoutely anywhere we wanted to without ever being questioned by police or soldiers etc. Later when the Russian photojournalist visited me in Houston he was shocked at how we were treated. We went to a mall and security immediately came to us and questioned us about what we were doing with cameras there. We were questioned by police at crime scenes and even once at an accident scene. This was in the early '90s after Russia changed. I gues we've changed a bit over here too. But for the worse.

-- Joe Cole (jcole@apha.com), November 16, 1999.