I've used mostly sheet film, but starting to do quite a lot of 120. Have some of the classic stainless roll film tanks and reels. I always manage to get the @#$% reels loaded somehow, but my darkroom vocabulary is starting to get mostly 4-letter. Are there now better state of the art reels that are easier to load, or would one of you roll film old timers care to share your secrets on how to easily get the film started on the reel? My vocabulary will thank you!

-- John Sarsgard (Endive4U@aol.com), January 05, 2000

Answers

Would you care to share your vocabulary for when the reel hits the floor and/or you step on the film. I have always felt mine to be somewhat repititious. It does not necessarily have to be for 120. Mitch

-- Bill Mitchell (bmitch@home.com), January 05, 2000.

I definitely prefer plastic. Just make sure they're perfectly dry, and be meditative otherwise the film buckles. Hell, sometimes it buckles even at full-Buddha...welcome to Our Boat.

shawn

-- shawn gibson (SeeInsideForever@yahoo.com), January 05, 2000.

I've picked up all my reels at yard sales and have noticed just recently (started processing 120 a month ago! only sheets and 135 previously) that there are definate differences in the two types of reels I have. The wire gauge is thin on the easy ones to load and much thicker on the ones that cause cursing and "moons" on my first frame. I wish I knew what name brands they both are, the reels are not engraved like the tanks... t

-- tom meyer (twm@mindspring.com), January 05, 2000.

John, It's been a long time since I worked extensively with 120, but I recall having some of the same difficulties. I tried many things and had my personal best results with good old Nikkor metal reels. Some things that also helped: When removing the paper wrapping from the film, leave the tape on the film end and fold it over to make a thicker, sturdier end to get under the spring at the center of the reel. Let the film roll back up loosely so that you can hold it in your right hand with one end between thumb and forefinger and bow it silightly so that it fits into the reel without scraping the sides. Insert the end under the spring in the center of the reel by lifting the spring slightly with the left index finger and slipping the end under. As for getting the rest of the film on the reel, my technique is to keep the film slightly bowed with my right hand, which is also in contact with the edges of the reel (thumb and forefinger) and then "pull" the film on to the reel by turning it with my lift hand. (This is a lot easier to do than describe). Take a test roll and load it onto your reels (all of them) in the light and adjust the spring tension with a pair of needle-nosed pliers or the like so that your initial fastening of the film end (with the tape) goes smoothly every time for every reel. Practice in the light and in the dark till you can do it every time. If you still get little "moons" (which are caused by kinking the film) every now and then on the first frame, you can keep in mind when shooting and simply burn that frame and shoot an 11 (or whatever) exposure roll. Another related word of caution. If you fill the metal tanks completely to the top, there is no room for the solutions to mix during agitation and you can get streaking, especially lines of more development near the edges of the film. This you can avoid by determining how much solution you need to just cover the reels completely, but not fill the tank full to the top, and use only this much solution for your tanks instead of the full amount. Vigorous agitaion helps too. Hope some of this helps. ;^D)

-- Doremus Scudder (ScudderLandreth@compuserve.com), January 06, 2000.

John, my best advice is to waste a roll or two and practice loading in daylight, watching what you do. Practice until you feel comfortable.

Then try it with your eyes closed, then in the dark, again with the same roll. Do it until your vocabulary has improved. :-)

Hope this helps!

-- Mason Resnick (bwworld@mindspring.com), January 06, 2000.

I'm not really an old timer, seeing as I am still in my twenties, but here's a tip that has always worked for me: Don't bother getting the film into the leader clip. It's not worth the hassle. I just hold the end of the film agianst the spool of the reel with my index finger, and start leading the film onto the reel with the other hand. Once I have almost all the film on the reel, I gently pull the film forward to ensure that the film at the start is in the grooves too and not touching itself. Finally I wrap the last bit of film on the reel. whuala! The most important thing about steel reels is this. IF THEY ARE BENT THEY ARE #$%^#-ING IMPOSSIBLE TO DEAL WITH!! So when you buy reels be sure to lay them out on a flat surface before you leave the store so as to ensure they are flat and level. Good luck.

-- Josh Randall (joshrandal@excite.com), January 06, 2000.

That's the most creative spelling of "voila" I've ever seen!... t

-- tom meyer (twm@mindspring.com), January 06, 2000.

Tom--not as creative as the way PePe LePew, the cartoon skunk with the fake French accent, pronounced the word: veeola! Another reason to love Warner Bros! (and their Warner sister, Dot)

OK, back to subject...

-- Mason Resnick (bwworld@mindspring.com), January 07, 2000.

Self-ratcheting platic reels are indeed easier to load. I've got a plastic tank (Patterson I think) that has them with ball-bearings, and they're a breeze to load, in fact they really load themselves.

Unfortunately, those reels don't fit in my Jobo, and the Jobo reels are a *lot* harder to load. Still nowhere near the difficulty of steel though.

Paul

-- Paul D. Robertson (proberts@clark.net), January 10, 2000.

The plastic Jobo reels are *very* easy to load(for both 120 and 135 films) if you recognize how to do it right...

The tendancy will be to first try to load the reel like a stainless steel reel, pushing the film in at the entry point continuously. This proves to be difficult. You'll notice a section of reel where the hard plastic edge is missing, and the slots exposed. Feed the film into the entry point with your left hand, holding the reel with your right hand. You should have your index and middle finger just above the entry slot(guide the film into the slot with these)while your thumb and ring finger hold the reel in the section described above(like a baseball pitcher would hold a fastball). When you feel the film edges poke your thumb and ring finger in this section(right hand), hold it there with these fingers, and let go of the film(from your left hand). Now hold the reel with your left hand and use your right hand to advance the film(the edges of the film are now exposed in the rimless section). Do this by firmly holding the film edges at the far left portion, and "pull" it the the far right(12 o'clock to 2 o'clock position of the reel). The reel should not move, only the film within it. Repeat until film is completely wound. You will be able to feel how many "layers" of the reel are accomodated by film also. The process may seem harder than it really is in this description. It's actually very quick and easy once you get the jist of it. Also, if you are familiar with Jobo reels and the "exposed" section of the reel to which I'm referring, the process will be far more easily visualized. As others have stated, practice in the light first, and make sure the reel you are using is dry. No matter what equipment I use in my darkroom, and how much experience I gain, a four-letter explitive will always be heard at least once every 10 minutes or so. It's those 4-letter words that make darkroom work both fun and humbling. Enjoy, and good luck!

-- Paul Klingaman (pklingaman@hotmail.com), January 10, 2000.

Thanks to one and all. Plenty of things to try here, both with my ancient stainless tanks and plastic reels, too. I'm going to see how I do with what I've got, and then try plastic reels if my vocabulary doesn't improve. However, as one poster said, the vocabulary is half the fun, so just want to reduce the frequency of @#$%. John

-- John Sarsgard (Endive4U@aol.com), January 11, 2000.

Paul Klingaman-

Are you saying that you don't ratchet the reel at all, but pull the film through it? My problem with the Jobo reels is that when loading them by moving half the reel at a time (per the instructions that came with them), my 120 film always seems to get askew at the part where the film sticks out, then a corner gets caught and wrinkled slightly. about 1 out of every 5 goes well, the other 4, 2 of them will recover from being off-track the first or second try, and two will take a while to get on.

I'd happily sacrifice a roll to the film gods if it meant successive correct loads in the future!

Paul

-- Paul D. Robertson (proberts@clark.net), January 14, 2000.

For the stainless reels, ignore the spring clip, wrap a short length of inch wide masking tape around the centre (in the light, of course) leaving just enough to tack the start of the film to. Use a good quality tape, or it'll come unstuck in the processing, and Sod's law states that the best frames will always be the ones that work out of the spiral and get scratched.

And a little tip that might help with the plastic reels.

Get them really dry, and then rub a small amount of Silicone grease (which is chemically inert)into the spirals. Wipe it almost all off again, so that there's hardly any visible sign of it. This really reduces the friction, and for the next few loadings your films will glide in. Renew the grease when loading gets sticky again. If you can't get silicone grease, try a waxy silicone furniture polish, NOT WD40!

Wishing you peace and moderate language,

-- Pete Andrews (p.l.andrews@bham.ac.uk), January 24, 2000.

The best reels I've found for 120 are the Hewes stainless from B&H. They're twenty bucks, but they almost load themselves. Hewes has a bit different design at the core so that once you get the film caught under the spring, it's almost started feeding into the spiral. I wish I had known about these years ago!

-- Brian Hinther (BrianH@sd314.k12.id.us), January 24, 2000.

So what about 220?? I have been using the Hewes stainless reels with 120 for a few months with no problems. recently shot a couple rolls of 220, went out and bought the 220 hewes reels, and when i got home and tried to use them i totally trashed both rolls of film. these things are so much harder to load than the 120s its unbelievable. is it just the hewes reels? any advice?

-- che (chebaby@hotmail.com), February 15, 2000.