Could you please post the list of nuclear targets in the U.S? Thank you

-- sittinginthelibrary (don'thave@one.org), March 26, 2000

Answers

Sure, but I'm not sure how reliable this site is. Furthermore, I'm wondering if you're worried about nuclear fallout? WHY? Isn't is easier to live your life without all the worry? I hope this doesn't make you made but, we all have to die sometime.

We should enjoy ourselves while we can!

(Can you tell I'm a true polly at heart?

:o)

Following list from site that has TONS of info about securing your home against nuclear war, EMP, etc. www.xsw.com/secure home BIG book available with instructions. THE TOP 10 MOST DANGEROUS NUCLEAR TARGETS IN OR NEAR A METRO AREA (there are several other primary targets not listed that are not near a major metro) 1. Washington DC /and related bases (major command and control for the President) 2. Colorado Springs, Co (Cheyenne Mtn Control Center, 2 space command/comm bases) 3. Omaha, Ne (secondary command and control bases) 4. Seattle, Wa. (Trident Missile Sub base and numerous Naval Bases) 5. Jacksonville Fl/Kings Bay Ga. (Trident Missile Sub base, Major East Coast Naval Center) 6. San Diego, Ca (largest west coast naval complex) 7. Norfolk, Va (major east coast naval complex) 8. Kansas City, Mo (Whiteman AFB, B-2 nuclear bombers) 9. Cheyenne, Wy (Warren AFB, Minute Man and Peacekeeper MX missiles) 10. Great Falls, Mt (Malmstrom AFB --Minute Man missiles)

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@....), March 26, 2000.

Wait a minute, I just had a better idea. Why don't you try:

www.askjeeves.com

Ask Jeeves

Better yet, why don't you take a field trip to Palo Verde? They have group tours there, and you can learn a lot about nuclear energy.

Even better than that; I think a trip to Camelback mountain in the morning would put things into better perspective. When was the last time you went there and checked out the blooming desert plants, or the doves cooing in the morning? We don't have much time left to enjoy that you know.

Please try and remember that the world is here for our pleasure, not our pain.

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@...), March 26, 2000.

LL,

If Palo Verde ever "cooks off", what is the fallout pattern? What are the prevailing wind patterns for the Phoenix area? How far will the stuff blow? Isn't Phoenix some sort of secondary target?

-- Justwonderin (Justwonderin@Fallout.Nukes), March 26, 2000.

My Dear justawonderin,

Sir (or madam) as the case may be...Phonix, Az. is a primary target (a fused air burst at 2,000 meters) according to the old "cold war" war plans of long ago. It still would be a primary target, if for nothing else, than if it and SLC where hit. The enemy would have effectively cut off the major (if not all) transport of goods and materials between the two coasts (east and west).

As far as Palo Verde goes...It is not a fast breeder reactor! And cannot explode! It could suffer a melt down, but the odds of that happening are millions to one. I hope that this will ease your mind.

"As for me...I shall finish the Game"!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Shakey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

-- Shakey (in_a_bunker@forty.feet), March 27, 2000.

Shakey's right, justwonderin,

Palo Verde is NOT a fast breed reactor. It can't "explode" like you're thinking. (Like I think, you're thinking?)

Last August I was worried as much about it as you are, so I drove over to the Department of Civil Defense down there on McDowell and asked those people all kinds of questions. I found out that if you live within 10 miles of the reactor, you might have cause to worry if they have a meltdown. However, the people who work there don't want to die, so they have made every precaution humanly possible to ensure the safety of that plant. That facility is the biggest one in the world, just, and we have the very finest techs in the world working out there.

I don't know where you live, but since you're worried about fallout patterns and wind direction I'm going to assume you live relatively close? I know you can't possibly live within ten miles, because the people in that area are provided information on a regular basis. If you live north of 32st, you never have to worry about the reactor because that's on the edge of where the fallout can go. I don't know if I still have it, but I had a map of Phoenix that I drew the circumference of the fallout area based on facts and figures I received from the CVD, and if you'd like to see it, give me a call and I'll try to dig it out for you. I also have the blast area for a one megaton bomb for air and surface area if you'd like to see that. I live in the north part of town, so if you want to meet downtown somewhere, I'll be happy to bring it. If you're too young to drive, have your parents call me and I'll bring it to your house.

(Don't try to e-mail me at my Ladylogic address. For some reason, it's been hosed for the last 24 hours. If you haven't already seen my number floating around at the old TimeBomb, e-mail me at I M Cissy@aol.com.)

Chow for now,

~*~

-- Laura (Ladylogic@...), March 27, 2000.

justwonderin,

Here's an interesting place to visit to see about nuclear blast effects in your locale. It came from an old thread on the TB2000 Deleted Threads forumn (old TB2K).

LINK

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), March 27, 2000.

Laura,

Isn't it kind of "gutsy" to make the kind of offer you made to justwonderin above? I realize that your motives are sincere, but how do you know that someone you meet on the Net isn't a wacko? Did you or someone else actually post your phone number sometime in the past? I guess if you have really been a PI, you most likely know how to take care of yourself. I understand that much of Phoenix is a lot "tougher" than it used to be. I read about a shooting at 44th St. and McDowell the other day. That used to be a decent area. What areas does one avoid today?

I'm surprised to hear that there is still a Department of Civil Defense anymore. The Feds certainly don't care about such things. Is it located inside the mountain in Papago Park. I used to go in there back in the early 70's.

My dad was a weatherman in the USAF, and years ago he studied fallout patterns and decided that Northern AZ didn't look too bad. Of course, that was back in the 50's and 60's when people were concerned about the cold war. Funny thing, we're at much greater risk than ever, today, from terrorist attacks, missles from North Korea, China, etc., but no one seems to care anymore.

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), March 27, 2000.

Hi, Flash,

"Isn't it kind of "gutsy" to make the kind of offer you made to justwonderin above?"

It might be a little "gutsy", but I'm not going to live my life in fear. I think it's safe to meet someone during daylight hours at a public place. Besides, if justwondering is a kid, I think his/her parents would welcome me with open arms if I teach him/her why s/he is worrying needlessly. (That was fun, I wish there were a generic term for fe/male.)

"Did you or someone else actually post your phone number sometime in the past?"

Yeah, I did. I posted it last November when I was terrified, and wanted to network with other single women. I think everybody probably pretty much forgot about it until Squire posted it with what she thought was my last name last month. (She was ticked off at my spamming, so she "outed" me.) It's not a big deal really, nobody can ever find out what my real name is by my phone number.

"I read about a shooting at 44th St. and McDowell the other day. That used to be a decent area. What areas does one avoid today?"

All of Phoenix! :o)

Actually, there's only a few places left in Phoenix proper that I think are nice. I love the Biltmore area, the Encanto area, and a small section just west of Central in the northern part of town. There's other nice areas of course, but the general rule is; the north and northeast sides are the best.

"I'm surprised to hear that there is still a Department of Civil Defense anymore. The Feds certainly don't care about such things. Is it located inside the mountain in Papago Park."

That's exactly the place I was talking about! Man, that place had a lot of Y2k meetings going on last year. I can't believe how much time and money was spent for nothing.

"I used to go in there back in the early 70's."

Why? Were you in the service? (Thank you, if you were.) I was just a snot-nosed senior in '71. It seems like a hundred years ago now.

"My dad was a weatherman in the USAF"

Was he stationed at Luke?

Funny thing, we're at much greater risk than ever, today, from terrorist attacks, missles from North Korea, China, etc., but no one seems to care anymore.

You're right, I don't think anybody cares anymore either. I don't even care anymore. Y2k taught me to live today; today, and to quit worrying about things I can't control. That was a hard lesson for me to learn, Flash, but I can guarantee ya, I've never felt more liberated in my life. Now that I can quit worrying about everything, I can get back to studying things I enjoy; and I even have time to write posts to people I enjoy!

Take care, neighbor.

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@...), March 27, 2000.

To LadyLogic,

I think there are lots of reasons to be scared, and I live in fear all the time. I, too attended several meetings at Papago Park. One memorable one was hosted by the Emergency Service Office, and included several informed speakers, such as the Police Chief, Sheriff, Fire Chief, and Mayor. Off the record, the Chief of Police informed me that there had been a rash or burglaries in the Biltmore area, but it had been kept at a low profile, to avoid undue attention from the press.

In addition, the threat of radiation is present as well. I do not believe your statement: "If you live north of 32st, you never have to worry about the reactor because that's on the edge of where the fallout can go." I, in fact, am located just norht of 32st, and I do not believe that radiation recognizes any man-made bounaries such as roads.

I do live in fear, with good reason. The world is a terrifying place, and there are numerous methods that calamity can befall an innocent person.

-- Scardy Cat (scardy@meow.cat), March 28, 2000.

Ok, Scardy Cat,

Go ahead and be afraid. There's lots of things I don't have any control over, and your emotions are one of them :o)

However, fallout patterns have been studied, and if you chose not to believe them, that's certainly your prerogative.

(By the way, I KNOW there's crime EVERYWHERE, including the Biltmore area. The Biltmore is considered a nice area of town because of the people who live there, the golf course, the hotel, the Wrigley Mansion, and the breath-taking homes there.)

Personally, I don't think there's any perfect place on EARTH, so why should we worry about where we live?

Like I said earlier, "We need to live today; today."

I hope you have a nice one!

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@...), March 28, 2000.

Scaredy Cat,

It's time to transform your fears through positive action. There are a variety of fairly simple things that you can do to protect yourself from potential crises. Of course, only one person in a hundred (or maybe even less) will ever make any effort to prepare beforehand. Let us know more about what your concerns are, and I for one, will be happy to suggest some ideas. A little knowledge about such things as radiation or bio-chem warfare can greatly reduce your personal risk in the unlikely event that any of these problems should occur, and help reduce your anxiety level considerably. Generally speaking, the best thing to do in an emergency is to stay home, secure your house, and wait things out. If you are outside and exposed, immediately shower and change to clean clothes. Some cheap dust masks from the drug store could also be very useful, especially if you have to drive home from work during a crisis. Have faith through reasonable action!

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), March 28, 2000.

here's some good sites

http://home.acadia.net/cbm/

http://www.clw.org/pub/clw/coalition/libhealt.htm

http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/index.html

http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Andes/6180/links.html

-- Johnny (Not@anymore.net), March 28, 2000.

Thanks for the web sites and the advise. I know in my head that what you guys are saying has some merit, but still feel this anxiety in my bones.

All last year, I was terrified of Y2K and all it would bring such as power failures, the collapse of banking, telephone failures, gas rationing, etc. I'm still VERY concerned about oil and gas, and fear that this may yet bring down society as we know it. The shortage of oil could also spark war/nuclear action. So yes, I'm concerned about fallout, but lack the means to buy/build a shelter or bunker. I am also concerned about the embedded systems that still yet may plague the nuke plants, and the subsequent radiation that may spread in the greater Phoenix area. Crime, as I alluded to, is a concern. I'm considering purchasing more guns and taking a marksmanship class. This may alleviate some of those fears. Since I met the Chief, I may also apply for a concealed weapons permit.

Do you think I'm a looney, or can you help???

-- Scardy Cat (scardy@meow.cat), March 28, 2000.

Scardy Cat,

Before you do anything silly, (like spend more money on preps, or guns, or anything like that) will you do something for me?

Will you spend the day on the shooting range with me? I used to be a Private Investigator, and I enjoy plinking my .38 on occasion. I'll even bring along my brother's Sig Saur if you want.

I have an even better idea. I'll bet I can personally introduce you to Dave, the Y2k representative of the Phoenix Police Department and he might be able to help put your fear into perspective. As a matter of fact, I'll bet I can talk Jim, the Y2k representative at Palo Verde into letting us visit the plant together.

Would you like to do any of the above? I'm willing to do any, or all of them with you because I really think you are going a little off the deep end with your fear. I'm thinking that if people you respect tell you that your fears are unfounded, maybe you won't worry so much?

Let me know.

(P.S. If your initials are MP: Shame on you :o)

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@...), March 28, 2000.

Hell I'll go to the shooting range with'ya!!!

Nothing sexier than a women with a gun.

-- Johnny (Not@anymore.net), March 28, 2000.

Careful Johnny!

A while back I was at the range teaching a lady how to shoot, and I noticed that he watching and then shook his head. I chatted with him while she was shooting and he said "the last lady I taught how to shoot, shot ME!" Then he showed me his scar.

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), March 28, 2000.

Sorry about flubbing the previous message. Maybe I need a beer!

It should have read:

A while back I was at the range teaching a lady how to shoot, and I noticed that the guy at the next shooting station was watching and then shook his head. I chatted with him while she was shooting and he said "the last lady I taught how to shoot, shot ME!" Then he showed me his scar.

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), March 28, 2000.

Laura,

You certainly seem to be well-connected. What caliber SIG does your brother have? A .38 is better than nothing, but I hope you use +P loads for serious work. What is it's barrel length? Personally, I prefer at least a .40 S&W (SIG P-229).

By the way, how do both you and Scardy Cat manage to live North of 32nd St.? The last time I looked, it ran more-or-less North and South? Is there some sort of an E-W loop that isn't on my map?

Scardy Cat,

If you are for real and not just Trolling, it might be interesting to take Laura up on her offers (both introductions and offer to shoot). If you are a troll, beware and read my previous message! My experience is that women who learn to shoot properly usually end up excellent shots, especially in self-defense type situations!!! How about that lady in Apache Junction a month-or-so ago?

What guns do you have already, and how well do you know how to handle and shoot them? Don't buy anything more until you talk with some knowledgable people about what best suits your needs and objectives.

Are you petite, slight, or solidly built? This has a bearing on how heavy a gun you would want, and how powerful the caliber should be. There seem to be a number of guys on this forum who are shooters (in addition to myself), and I'm sure they would all be glad to give you their opinions on guns.

Getting a CCW permit and taking the Arizona 16 hour course to qualify for it is an excellent idea. Try and take it from a Police instructor, if possible. Remember, your most vulnerable situation is going to and from your car. Also, if Phoenix has turned into the Wild West since I last lived there (I left in late '72), it sounds like cheap insurance. I live about 2 hours North of you folks, and up here EVERYONE seems to have guns. Interestingly, we have relatively few problems, and hardly anyone gets shot! As they say, "an armed society is a polite society."

Regarding nuclear fallout, it depends on whether it is mostly low-level (e.g. a core meltdown) or higher-altitude due to a nuclear bomb (usually an air burst). But the bottom line is HEAD NORTH. As I mentioned in an earler post on this thread, my ex-military, weatherman dad (small "w" in weatherman) studied all the wind patterns and liked what he saw about Northern AZ. Of course, the farther North from Phoenix, the better!

Another thing to consider: although most people know that it is a good idea to take Potassium Iodide, or the longer-lasting Potassium Iodate in the event of exposure to nuclear fallout, they usually don't know that in a pinch, you can just rub Iodine on your body and it will be absorbed and do pretty much the same thing.

I recently learned that what kills you from high-dose radiation exposure is a massive release of free-radicals by your body in reaction to the irradiation. If this is really true, then it would seem that taking massive doses of Vitamin C (powder) and other good antioxidants (e.g. Pycnogenol) for several days after exposure might confer some protection from the free-radical damage. It's sure worth a try if the need ever arises.

So much for my soapboxing.

Laura, it just struck me that you have stumbled on another way to get men talking --- ask them about guns (and don't let them know how much you already know)! By the way, have you lived in Phx for a long time? If so, what high school did you go to?

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), March 28, 2000.

Since we're on the subject of self-defense, particularly in the Phoenix area:

http://www.azcentral.com/news/0202kidnap.shtml Woman kills rape suspect in her home

By Peter Ortiz The Arizona Republic Feb. 2, 2000

When a man broke into her Apache Junction home early Tuesday and announced, "I'm going to kill everyone," Bricie Tribble didn't hesitate.

She reached for the handgun on her kitchen counter and shot the man dead. Only later did she realize that she knew the man and that he was believed to have raped and shot a woman just an hour earlier.

The man's death ended a night of terror that began in a Wal-Mart parking lot in Chandler at about 11 p.m. Monday when the man pedaled his bike up to a 33-year-old woman and asked for the time.

Police said the man pushed the woman into her sport utility vehicle and forced her at gunpoint to drive to a desert road in northeast Mesa, where he sexually assaulted her and shot her in the cheek, right arm and chest.

The attacker drove off in the woman's vehicle, but she managed to make it to a nearby house and place a 911 call.

"The guy raped me and then he took off in my truck," the terrified woman told the operator. "I guess he left figuring I was dead. I am not dead."

A little after midnight, the man, in his 20s, was inside Tribble's Apache Junction home going through the personal belongings of the sexual-assault victim, which he had brought into the house, police said.

Tribble, 28, grabbed the loaded handgun and fired several times. She later told an emergency operator that she recognized the man she had just shot as a former worker in her husband's excavation business.

Tribble's husband, Jeff, and 9-year-old nephew were also in the home but were not harmed.

The dead man's name was being being withheld by the Chandler police pending further investigation.

* * * Reach the reporter at Peter.Ortiz@ArizonaRepublic.com or (602) 444-7726.

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), March 28, 2000.

Laura,

Thank you for your suggestion and invitation to the range. Would this be at the Police Dept., or where? I'd be too nervous to actually meet the officers you suggest, but thank you for the thought.

Flash and LL,

The only hand gun I have is one I inherited. A S&W .32 long...as you can imagine, not much stopping power. See why I'm nervous? I have not taken the 14 hour class, so that is an excellent idea. Do either of you know where & when it is held, or who to contact about it?

Flash, you're right that 32nd still goes north/south, but I am actually near W. Maryland Ave. Laura, is that in the danger zone for fallout. I have an order for potasium iodide already, but it is back ordered.

Ya know, a funny thing's happening. I'm feeling less nervous as I write this.

Have a nice day!

-- Scardy Cat (scardy@meow.cat), March 28, 2000.

Scardy Cat,

Most police officers are really pretty nice folks, except maybe when they are giving you a ticket! I'd jump at the chance if I were you, to meet Laura's police or security friends at some point, although maybe you want to meet her first.

Laura can probably help you find a good CCW class and instructor. If not, I'm sure some of my friends in the PD and Sheriff's office up here could find out who's good down your way.

A .32 Long is better than nothing, but mostly only for bluff value. If you ever shot someome with it who was agitated and intent on getting you, they might die later, but they would probably get you first. Still, the idea is to scare them off and not need to shoot, if possible, so looking and acting like you mean business is important. You will learn/practice some of this in the class.

Personally, I wouldn't even consider anything less than a .357 magnum, or a .38 special with +P ammunition. A .357 is nice because you can also shoot .38's in it for practice, or if you decide that .357's are too hot. Women are usually steered to revolvers because they are less complicated and more reliable than semi-autos, but some of the newer semi-autos are pretty reliable (e.g. Glock, SIG, etc.). After all, the police carry them and trust their lives to them. I like a .40 S&W double-action semi-auto. The bigger the bullet, the more stopping power, and the more scare value, too!

Have fun learning all the new stuff, and don't hesitate to ask questions. Although you probably don't have to worry about a biowar attack in Arizona, a couple of rolls of duct tape, and one of the new HEPA vacuum cleaners can make you a nifty safe room. Contrary to what most people know, Anthrax spores can be easily killed with Chlorox, and break down after about a week of exposure to good-old sunlight. Maybe even faster in the Arizona variety! Plague bacilli don't do too well when confronted with Chlorox or sunlight, either.

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), March 28, 2000.

Laura,

You wrote "Personally, I don't think there's any perfect place on EARTH, so why should we worry about where we live?

I do believe that there is one place on earth that is as close to perfect as it gets, and that is right here in New Zealand's South Island. Nuclear and pollution free, spectacular scenery with rugged mountains and clear blue lakes, brilliant warm summers, crisp cold winters, low humidity etc.

There is only one thing that makes it not quite perfect......

Anytime you want to go for a vacation, you must go somewhere not quite as good. Australia, or the Pacific Islands etc, but at least those places are still a break from home. ;-)

-- Malcolm Taylor (taylorm@es.co.nz), March 28, 2000.

that is right here in New Zealand's South Island. Nuclear and pollution free, spectacular scenery with rugged mountains and clear blue lakes, brilliant warm summers, crisp cold winters, low humidity etc.

Stop it, Malcolm. You're making me envious beyond belief. One of my dad's buddies moved to New Zealand, and he said it was the best move he's ever made. I think someday when I can chose where I live, I'm going to head straight over there. (By the way, Jim, at Palo Verde that I mentioned earlier, told me at dinner one night that he came from there. He said that men dress casual there all the time. He said they wear shorts all year 'round. He said they wear business jackets with their shorts: is that true??)

Scardy Cat,

Have you ever heard of Ben Avery Shooting range? It's a world class facility, and it's north of town up by Lake Pleasant. We can shoot there for $5.00 and put lots of little holes in paper targets. However, I need to know how old you are, honey. If you're under 21, I just wouldn't be comfortable taking you out there.

Do you live around 19th and Maryland? If you do, that explains a lot of things, and I can give you some safety tips that'll make you sleep better at night. I'll have to do it in person though, because it would take too long to type everything out.

I'm glad you're not as frightened. I'm not as frightened anymore either. I think once people have some basic knowledge of survival, they feel a sense of security, and the fear just seems to melt away........

SC, if you're under 21, I can still teach you a LOT about survival without taking you to the range. Once you learn survival methods, you more than likely will never need a gun. Most of these guys in this chat room would probably have you buy some high-caliber weapon because they live in s rural area and hunt, or they have a lot of testosterone :o)

Personally, I do NOT advocate anyone spend a lot of money on weapons. The chance that you'll ever need to use it in your lifetime is infinitesimal.

Let me know what you want to do. I'll make Sunday afternoon free if you want to go. Or, we can also just meet for a Coke, if you just want to talk about this stuff. Either way is Ok with me.

My e-mail address is Ladylogic46@aol.com. Once you e-mail me, I'll send you my phone number and we can get together.

Flash,

My brother has a Sig Saur .226, but I'm not much into gun discussions. I think all they do is provide peace of mind, but they're not worth putting any effort into typing about. I hope you guys have a ball with your discussions though!

I gotta get out of here early tonight. My interests have changed to e-biz and I have a lot of studying to do.

Chow for now,

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@...), March 28, 2000.

"Personally, I do NOT advocate anyone spend a lot of money on weapons. The chance that you'll ever need touse it in your lifetime is infinitesimal."

LL - Please reread the above article about the Apache Junction lady, and the lady who was abducted from a Wal-Mart parking lot in Chandler, raped, shot, and left for dead.

I agree that safety consciousness and anticipating troublesome situations and taking steps to avoid them is the best way to go. Also a can of the hottest pepper spray you can find is a good idea. But... for those times/situations that may require a little more, having your trusty pistol with you is most reassuring.

I recomment the book: "Armed and Female" by Paxton Quigley

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), March 28, 2000.

I have a lot of estrogen and I target practice all the time. You don't need to go to a firing range to practice shooting, you've got thousands of miles of desert in Arizona. I have many guns and like shooting them all. My favorite targets are the human image ones on paper.

-- Annie Oakley (AnnieOakleyyy@AnnieOakleyy.xcom), March 28, 2000.

Annie, you sound like my kind of lady! Back in the 60's I used to drive for 5 or 10 minutes to the nearest embankment, put up some beer cans (steel ones) and blaze away. Now, it seems that there are houses everywhere. What part of AZ are you in?

My grandmother was sort of an "Annie Oakley" lady back on the Colorado Prairie in the early 1900's. She could outshoot the men, and had a barn covered with coyote skins. Back then, the coyotes were a lot more aggressive than they are today. My dad said that when they went to town, the dog had to run underneath the carriage because the coyotes would pace them alongside -- except when his mom was riding with them! Then, no coyotes could be found!!!

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), March 28, 2000.

Sorry, Flash,

I NEVER advocate that people buys guns. Scardy Cat said that s/he already has a .32, and that's good enough to learn how to shoot with. S/he also mentioned having a "lack of means" so I'm not about to tell her/him to go out and purchase another weapon.

IF s/he should ever needs to use that weapon for protection, s/he can put hollow points in it, and it'll be good enough. You people have to realize real-life isn't like the internet where you can dream something up and have it appear before your eyes on the screen.

Furthermore, an armed society is NOT necessarily a polite society. Canada does NOT have our liberal gun laws and they have less crime.

Sorry, but we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one.

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@...), March 29, 2000.

Dear Laura,

I am infact an adult, and do live roughly in the neighborhood you mentioned. I graduated from Arcadia HS in the early 80s, dropped out of college, and have worked odd jobs, light construction, maintenance, custodial, etc. ever since.

I thank you for your hospitality and offer to meet and help me get some things straighened out. When this reality comes crashing in, I realize that my fears and inertia have overcome my ability to act. As you said, the internet is not "reality." It is easier talking here to strangers than to actually talk in a relationship/friendship.

Again, thank you, dear lady. I will write to you if I build up the nerve.

All the best,

-- Scardy Cat (scardy@meow.cat), March 29, 2000.

I realize that my fears and inertia have overcome my ability to act.

I'm not gonna worry about you too much. Anyone who understands what you just said has a pretty good head on their shoulders.

Take care, Mister. I'm always around if you need me.

~*~
-- (Ladylogic@......), March 29, 2000.

-- Patsy Cline (crazy@crazy.crazy), March 29, 2000.

Xena Warrior Princess

-- comebackshane (Misery@xx.king), March 29, 2000.

You've been listening to Phone-in Phoenix, presented by Laura "The Angel" Logic, and "Fast-hand" Flash, your knowledgable and caring friends, just a phone call away . . .

This program was brought to you by our friends at Arnie's Gun and Tackle store.

Next up is our late night abuse line, presented by "Howling" Hawk Hawkster, and The troublesome Uncle. Meantime, here's a soothing little number from Steely Dan . . .

{cue music}

:)

W

-- w0lv3r1n3 (w0lv3r1n3@yahoo.com), March 30, 2000.

Anyone living in the Phoenix area, or contemplating providing personal information to this woman, needs to think very carefully:

I thank God I don't live in the same town as you, or any of the other sysops, because, if I did, I would make it my life's work to make sure everyone of your neighbors knew what type of man you really are.

I gotta go. The rage, hate, and even pity, I feel for you is eating me up.

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@...), March 30, 2000.

-- (YIKES@yikes.ack!), March 30, 2000.

YIKES!

Where did you find that? Link please!

-- barflyinmybeer (Yikesindeed!@the.bar), March 30, 2000.

In all fairness folkes theres another post after that snippet.That better reflects something good goin' on here.

Yikes ass !!! tell the whole story or nothin' but the truth so help you God.Play fair.

The correct thread is "Confidential To Shakey" ( for speeds sake)

-- capnfun (capnfun1@excite.com), March 30, 2000.

Thanks, W!

I didn't realize you had such an imagnation! That was funny, and your timing couldn't have been better.

Yikes,

As usual, you only tell part of the story and try twist the truth. However, people have witnessed your antics and to most people, you're impotent.

Chuck

"Truth, Honesty, and Forthrightness"

"peace, love, and forgiveness"

Thanks for reminding me, Sift & Cin.

I was angry with Chuck when I wrote that post. Obviously, I've been angry with him and the other sysops for a long time. A funny thing happened today though. After I wrote that post to let him know angry I was,...actually I was hurt....I felt like a burden was lifted.

I know in his heart he thought/thinks he's doing the right thing, and it pains me to see a fellow human being be so dead-set in his ways; expecially on an issue as important as censorship because it affects everyone's life, even if they don't recognize it.

However, being upset with Chuck isn't going to do me, or him any good. I've never read the Bible, but I think it says something about forgiving your enemies; and I don't think truer words have ever been spoken. I'm a human being and I mess up sometimes, just like Chuck and cavscout, and everybody else in the world, and I guess we all need to be forgiven something. I promise to work on forgiving people in the future, 'cause Lord knows, I'm not perfect and need forgiveness too.

I'm sorry, Chuck. I hope we all have a better life; including you.

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@.....), March 30, 2000.

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@....), March 30, 2000.

Hi, Capn!

We must have posted at the same time!

Thanks for coming to my rescue like that. It was sure nice of you. I just can't seem to get a fair shake with my trolls, and I appreciate it whenever someone steps in and gives me a helping hand.

Later, capn'. I'll seee ya around the docks.

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@...), March 30, 2000.

Anyone ever notice how Ladyillogic always back peddles when her ass has been nailed? I'm sure she was drunk or off her meds when she posted that.

-- tit-4-tat (tit-4-tat@tit-4-tattt.xcom), March 30, 2000.

Wonderland..tonight on NBC

-- concerned (bedlam@snakepit.ed), March 30, 2000.

Anyone ever notice how Ladyillogic always back peddles when her ass has been nailed?

Please explain how she backpedalled here.

I'm sure she was drunk or off her meds when she posted that.

And what's your excuse for posting this??

... ...

-- (hmm@hmm.hmm), March 30, 2000.

Free speech?

-- tit-4-tat (tit-4-tat@tit-4-tattt.xcom), March 30, 2000.

Next up is our late night abuse line, presented by "Howling" Hawk Hawkster, and The troublesome Uncle.

I'm no trouble Wolfie, no trouble at all. I can feed myself, I clothe myself, I even clean up after myself. When I'm finished doing my dirty, I can even wipe my own bum.

I'm a big boy now.

-- Uncle Deedah (unkeed@yahoo.com), March 30, 2000.

Yea,it's this real neat thing started along time ago,George Washington and his buddies really,really believed in it.It means saying what you want anytime you want,like you just did.

I know you probably hang at the SLEZ board and don't get out much,but it's kinda nice ain't it.You are free to try it often.

Just Another Freedom Fighter : )

-- capnfun (capnfun1@excite.com), March 30, 2000.

ROFLMBO...

Uncle Deedah said ' when I'm done I can even wipe my own bum '.

Unc, come on now dude you aint that old, DO YOU WATCH THE TOM GREEN SHOW?

The BUM BUM song RULES........

-- consumer (shh@aol.com), March 31, 2000.