I need help with tent worms in my apple and peach trees. I know B.T. works but will it hurt my bees ? baby bees are a larva (isn't that a worm or at least worm like) so and insecticide just for worms brought back by adult bees ? I would prefer an organic solution but any thing that won't hurt the bees will work. Thanks Becky

-- Becky (Joel681@webtv.net), April 06, 2000

Answers

if you have a propane torch, like they use for roofs, i use that to burn em out. it has a long handle and not that heavy.

-- stan (sopal@net-port.com), April 06, 2000.

Becky, I've been trying to find some notes I took years ago in Master Gardener training through Extension. I can't find them but if memory serves, the Bt is sprayed on the plant, caterpillar eats plant, the Bt organism paralyzes the gut and the caterpillar dies. Since bees don't chew the plant, only take nectar and by coincidence pollen, and the bee larvae are already in the cells and are fed honey, I don't think the bees or their larvae are at risk. If it were a contact poison even a more benign one like rotenone, the bees would definitely be affected. Hope this eases your worries some.

-- marilyn (rainbow@ktis.net), April 06, 2000.

I use the tall bamboo beach torches to reach up into the trees and burn them out.

-- Connie (connie@lunehaven.com), April 06, 2000.

My husband just pulls the tents down and stomps on them to kill them. Works!!!!

-- barbara (barbaraj@mis.net), April 06, 2000.

BT, and there are several different varieties that target different pests, will kill ONLY caterpillars (or in one case, potato beetle larva). They will not harm anything but caterpillars. So they are great for your purposes. And BT IS organic. A word of caution: some caterpillars are good guys. The Black Swallow-tail butterfly larvae (catterpillars) feed on dill as a favorite food. Monarchs prefer milkweed. Don't spray Bt on either. I usually just plant extra dill to feed the Swallowtails, and there's enough for both of us. Good luck!

-- Brad (homefixer@mix-net.net), April 06, 2000.

My grandmother had tentworms very bad in two huge sweetgum trees. We sprinkled diatomaceous earth around the base of the trees. It is a harmless powder that you may be able to get at your feed store. They use it now for swimming pool filter material(read the label to make sure). The worms have to drop from the tree every three days. When they crawl across the powder it cuts them open and they slowly leak to death. it will not harm beneficial insects. It works on termites and other soft bodied insects too.

-- Anita (gilesco900@cs.com), April 07, 2000.

Bee larvae also eat pollen so anything you spray on the blossoms could get to them. The DE sounds like a great solution. I'm going to try that with tent caterpillars!

-- Peg (jnjohnsn@pressenter.com), April 07, 2000.

Anita - are you quite sure about the tentworm caterpillars dropping down? I know that is the case with gypsy moth caterpillars, but have never seen this behavior in tent caterpillars. Good luck.

-- Brad (homefixer@mix-net.net), April 07, 2000.

DE is a great idea for garden slugs and worms. Also takes care of fleas. But make sure you get the garden grade and NOT the swimming pool filter grade. The filter grade will NOT work. The diatoms are too small and fine to destroy the critters. Paulette

-- paulette mark (kiwi333@ipa.net), April 09, 2000.

Do you have tent worms which weave a tight web in the fork of the branches or web worms which weave loose webs in the leaves and then eat the leaves. They are different and web worms are worse. I heard the other day that tent worms won't hurt the trees. (could be wrong)

-- Vaughn (vdcjm5@juno.com), April 09, 2000.

Tent worms will strip a tree bare if there are enough of them. I've seen it many times. But I don't know how much long-term damage this causes. I would think some, as it must weaken the tree, especially when it is repeated year after year. Often they are only on a few branches, which may not really hurt much, but when the whole tree is covered . . .

-- Kathleen Sanderson (stonycft@worldpath.net), April 12, 2000.

Can only add a few thoughts here: Tent Caterpillers can and will, in fact ravage certain types of trees. To the best of my knowledge I have never witnessed them dropping from trees, although the diat. earth suggestion is very helpful with most anything that does in fact crawl over it. As chemicals are chemicals , I have had perfect success burning the tents, with minimal foliage damage, for years. I've always used propane torch (attached to stick if I couldn't reach), but I'm sure any consistently hot flame would work.

Much Luck

-- Dan Baker (dcbaker@2ki.net), April 12, 2000.

Believe me, they ARE dropping from trees this year. I have never, ever seen them so bad. Can't wait to see what next year brings! Next year, I am going to go for the BT early. I've never used that before, but I have to do something. No one can even sit outside without them crawling on you. JH

-- J. Harlan (gim403@theremc.com), April 25, 2001.

I have the tent worms bad in a tree close to the house. Didn't see them in that tree till 3 days ago. They are crawling everywhere out to the end of limbs, making webs to crawl down and some are just dropping. They are crawling up on our house. Its really digusting. How long will they last till they are gone?

-- Barb Hensel (hensel@1st.net), April 28, 2001.

I have a pretty bad tent worm problem this year also. Several of the responses referred to BT. What is that? I like the idea of burning them out, but one of our trees that is the most infested is very tall, so burning is not practical. Any suggestions? Deb

-- Debbie Leone (leone@inter-linc.net), April 28, 2001.

BT (Bacillus thuringiensis ), a live bacteria that selectively kills all sorts of caterpillars without harming wildlife such as birds, bees or people. For best results, open the nest with a stick , then saturate the inside with the BT. Also spray surrounding leaves, since the webworms must ingest the liquid for it to do any good. (Although a number of chemical controls are available, most of them are poisonous to wildlife and humans, so I don't recommend them.)

-- Marke (pinehill@alltel.net), May 02, 2001.

I don't have an answer, but rather, a question. We have literally millions of the tent worms crawling everywhere. As far as we can tell, they have been around for about 2 weeks now. How long will they stay around? Would they be gone by the 1st of June? There are so many of them that it would be impossible to try and spray at this point. Our home is at the edge of a forest and there are too many trees to try and do damage control. Suggestions, anyone?

-- Judi Roberts (judirobe@indiana.edu), May 02, 2001.

I also have billions of tent worms. My house is surrounded by trees. I have 18 Aristrocrat pear trees that are totally covered with the nasty little critters. I have been spraying Malathon but it seems that for every million I kill another million replaces it. I have a cat and a dog and am very concerned about their safety. A friend has used "Seven" and it doesn't seem to work either. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. They are driving me crazy! How much longer..... and does this mean that this will happen again next spring? This is the first time I have had this problem.

-- Lisa Farmer (lisafarmer@msn.com), May 02, 2001.

Two races of fall webworms occur in North America, the blackheaded and redheaded races. The blackheaded race has caterpillars which are light greenish-yellow to pale yellow with two rows of distinct black tubercles. The redheaded race is more tan in color with orange to reddish tubercles. The caterpillars make distinct jerking movements in unison if the nest is disturbed. The adults are about one inch long and range from pure white to white with a few black spots.

This pest overwinters in the pupal stage. Pupae are usually in the ground but can be located in old nest remains, under loose bark and in leaf litter. The adults emerge from late May into July. The eggs are usually deposited in a single (blackheaded race) or double (redheaded race) layer of several hundred eggs on the undersurface of leaves. The mass is lightly covered with scales from the female's abdomen. The eggs hatch in about a week and the small mass of caterpillars web over single leaves and feed by skeletonizing. As the caterpillars grow, they web over additional leaves and finally are able to eat the entire leaf. The larvae mature in about six weeks, at which time they drop to the ground to pupate. The moths emerge over an extended period in two generations can normally be completed. In southern states, adults can emerge in mid-March and up to four generations can be completed.

Control Hints Though the webs are very unsightly, damage to most trees is considered to be insignificant. However, in southern states where several generations of attack can severely defoliate trees, control measures are needed. This pest tends to go through periodic population explosions. Outbreaks every four to seven years may last for two to three years and then natural control agents greatly reduce the activity.

Strategy 1: Mechanical Control - Removal of Nests - Small nests can be pruned out of small to medium trees. Monitor trees early to detect the nests when only several leaves are involved. These small nests can be easily crushed. Do not burn or torch the nests in trees as this may do additional damage to the tree.

Strategy 2: Biological Control - Encourage Predators and Parasites - Over 80 species of parasites and predators have been identified in North America. Social wasps (yellow jackets and paper nest wasps), birds, predatory stink bugs and parasitic flies and wasps are the most important. Delay destruction of wasp nests until August when social wasps change from carnivores to sugar feeders. Try to withhold contact insecticide sprays until it is certain that predators and parasites are not present in sufficient numbers to control the webworms.

Strategy 3: Biological Control - Apply Bacillus thuringiensis (Bt) - The bacterial insecticide, Bt, is quite effective against fall webworms if it is applied when the larvae are small. Use formulations with UV protectants and thoroughly cover leaves next to nests. As these leaves are incorporated into the nest and eaten, the Bt will be ingested.

Strategy 4: Chemical Control - Standard Insecticide Sprays - Most applicators attempt to "blow" the nest out of the tree with a strong jet of insecticide mix. While this generally works, more material is often used than is needed. Locate nests early and merely wet the nest and cover nearby foliage. As the larvae walk on the nest surface or incorporate new foliage, they will contact the insecticide. Second applications may be needed if additional generations occur.

Strategy 5: Chemical Control - Use Systemic Insecticides - Extensive nests may occur in tall trees which are difficult to spray with ground equipment. These trees can often be treated with translocated systemics applied to the soil for root uptake or injected.

-- Marke (pinehill@alltel.net), May 03, 2001.

One solution I'm trying is wrapping tin foil around the stump of the trees. About 3 feet up from the bottom(on trees that currently have no nest to protect them from invasion) Then spreading vassalin over it. If they can't get up the tree that can't hury it. Here in Northern Ontario we have just stated to see the nests so we haven't seen the damage yet. I'll keep you posted if this solution detours them.

-- Grace Urbanski (grace.urbanski@city.greatersudbury.on.ca), May 25, 2001.

Here in the Upper Penninsula of Michigan (Houghton). The tent worms are getting really bad!!! I live in the country and have been seeing them every where. The worms are still small and mostly in thier "Tents". I broke open the nest and sprayed Diazon directly on the worms. Dead in seconds! I had to be careful not to spray any on the apple blossoms. So far it has been the solution.

-- H A S (hschjoth@yahoo.com), May 26, 2001.

I have found that making a 1:5 dilution of Dawn dish soap and water works well. They are on my garage doors and house. I spray the solution on them and they die. This is a quick fix for areas around your home. However we have a great infestation this year. They are just crawling in the grass. Yuck!

-- Karen (drjdlaka@wiktel.com), May 28, 2001.

I have no solution. I live in Northern Wisconsin where the tent worms have just ravaged the area. I live on the opposite side of my mother on a chain of lakes and felt fortunate not to have this problem the last two years. My mother on the other hand and the whole downtown area was leafless all last summer and most homes looked like gingerbread houses when the cocoon stage came. Well it seems they starved themselves out and now I have them everywhere. It sounds like rain as they drop from the trees. I am afraid of the burning out concept as I am in the woods on sandy soil and mostly pine trees. Neighboring towns have used soap and water with fire hoses to wash the downtown streets. I am going to try this in possibly an old miracle-gro empty container that will attach to my garden hose. I will let you know if I have any success. I am trying to cut my grass after the 40 days of rain we just had and the worms are horrendous.

-- Donna (snowboundbabe@hotmail.com), May 28, 2001.

i have somethig similar to wrapping tinfoil and using vasaline. you can allso use duck tape and vasaline. yes it does work trust me!!! i have also heard that spraying the cacoons with vinigar and water work to kill them in that state. try both and let me know how it works for you.

-- michelle ballinger (mlynneballinger@netscape.net), May 29, 2001.

Well I really don't have a answer to the question. More like a question. My house is really infested with them. Weonly haev one tree. But our neighbor that lives behind us has 3 trees and they are coming to us. So what is the best solution to kill them.

-- Priscilla (Priscilla_liu20012002@hotmail.com), May 30, 2001.

Yesterday we had no tent worms...today there are billions everywhere. You drive down the back roads and if you have the windows rolled down, it sounds like you are driving over popcorn all over the place. They are into the trees big time, and there are whole swaths of trees in the woods that have been denuded -- oaks, poplar, birch, cherry, and apples seem to be the hardest hit. They are also after my lilacs,& gooseberries.

There are just too many everywhere to spray poisons on -- you'd end up poisoning every person and animal in a 50 mile radius to kill them all. I've got BT coming in two days time (til then, I am handpicking, stomping, drowning, and snipping them in half, trying to slow them down until it arrives), but I'm going to try the Dawn dishwashing solution with a tree sprayer. There are just too many of them, and whatever birds are willing to eat them seem to be full to bursting, and aren't eating any more.

Do they eat tomatoes and other garden produce?

-- julie f. (rumplefrogskin@excite.com), June 01, 2001.

I don't have an answer. My question is how long do they last? We are on a lake in northern Minnesota..they are stripping our huge bass woods. Help

-- Patricia Wilke (PatricaWilke@Guidant.com), June 05, 2001.

Here in KY, the Vet people are saying that these worms are the cause of foals dieing.Around 500. The worm eats cherry leaves which in turn produces toxin that they excreat which in turn the animal ingestes when eating grass. Quess this could apply to any grass eating animal, don't know for sure.

-- lexi Green (whitestone11@hotmail.com), June 05, 2001.

We have millions of those gross caterpillars and they have eaten most of the popular, birch, maple,lilac, apple, plum and oak trees bare. You can actually see them drop from trees and also hear them & their dropping hit the ground. We have them so bad that you could spend all day squishing them and not real accomplish to much. We have noticed that soapy water sprayed on them seems to kill them in about 15 minutes or so but the problem is that they stay and die where you sprayed them that it is difficult to tell which ones are new unless you can see them actually move. Another thing that has worked so some extent is at the base of the tree wrap duct tape and put vasoline on it. That way they can't climb up from the bottom. This needs to be done early. This will not help if they can swing from their nasty string or if the wind blows them to the next tree. This has helped in the areas that there are few trees. We have them so bad that the roads are covered with them and when a car goes by you can actually hear them pop. I can't wait for them to all die!!!!!!!!!!!!! Rhinelander, Wisconsin.

-- Shawn Belanger (ssjoink@g2a.net), June 07, 2001.

Those nasty worms are going to cocoon and turn into moths, that will lay more eggs for next year's crop. Destroy their tents (burn them) when they make them! Yech!

-- Joy F [in So. Wisconsin] (CatFlunky@excite.com), June 08, 2001.

Here in the UP of Michigan there everywhere!! On our highschool wall there everywhere it looks like the wall is moving! I try stepping on them as much as possible but there so nasty!! Sometimes u can here them falling from the trees in the woods!! When you walk through the woods there hanging down so u gotta watch out!!!

-- Ashley Johnston (kanon49783@hotmail.com), June 11, 2001.

Again, like most I have no answer to this problem but yet another contribution. I live in Manitoba and they are terrible here. However, we are facing a problem much more grave than any "popping noise." Here, the tent worms are littered across the highway and have caused several accidents; when you drive over them and try to brake, you go sliding across the road. Manitoba does not allow spraying so we are enduring these terrible pests. I don't have an answer and I guess all we can do is wait until this cycle has ended.

-- Britt (britt.helen@sympatico.ca), June 19, 2001.

We've been battling them for what seems like weeks here. Spraying them with water with a healthy squirt of dishwashing liquid in it will kill a lot of them by suffocation (in a sprayer). I have also been giving them Bt (bacillus thurengis) seems to be helping. We hand pick a lot of them off the trees and bushes and drown them in buckets of water with dishwashing liquid in (makes them sink fast and drown), have been doing it for a week at least now. It doesn't make a large impact on the population as a whole, but it helps around my own plants to keep the worms from weakening them.

-- julie f. (rumplefrogskin@excite.com), June 20, 2001.

I am currently compiling video of large insect infestations for an artistic project, i would like anyone who witnesses a large seasonal infestation to e-mail me. I am looking for a surreal video documentation of various infestations & human interaction with such. I will also fund the filming, any format is acceptable.

-- Randall Waterman (randy_waterman76@yahoo.com), March 23, 2002.