I am sure this is in the Goat archives somewhere, but I am in kind of a rush today. Also, my "Raising Goats the Modern Way" book is somewhere in the garage! I will look in Carla Emery's book, though, since that's always around.

I went out to see about 2 Nubian wethers that need homes this morning...the blackberry thing has always kind of pushed me this direction, PLUS we have talked about goats for years. I love their personalities. We have gone to shows, looked at different breeds, etc. However, it has been a long time since I read up on them much, which brings me to my questions (finally, you say!)

These guys are siblings, and were rescued last fall by some well meaning, but not very goat savvy people. They are looking to give them a good home, which we could provide. Their hooves are really overgrown (don't think they have ever been trimmed...boys are a year and a half old, they think). They have no horns, have nice dispositions (bottle fed?). I didn't see any rot in their hooves, just some work to trim. When (if, but probably) I bring them home they will be quarantined for a month or so, in their own paddock..about 100 x 100 or so, full of blackberries, alder saplings, plus some grass. Current owners are feeding alfalfa/goat hay, plus some forage. What do I need to be concerned about re: moving them to different feed? They are not currently getting grain. Should they? They are kind of thin. Can I worm them with Ivomec? Same dosage as sheep? I doubt they have inocculations...do they get C/DT only? What else can you tell me? I really liked the animals. Oh, we also have a 4 foot Gallagher New Zealand fence with 7 strands of hot wire. I don't think they could get a purchase on the wires. Quarantine cross fencing will be 4 foot field fence, and I could hot wire at the top. Supposedly they aren't jumpers and are currently contained behind 4 foot field fence with a hot wire.

Sorry to ramble, but I have to run. I would appreciate your info, as I am probably forgetting lot of things.

Thank you so much. We can pick them up in the next couple of weeks.

Oh yeah, do you run your goats with your sheep? Thanks!

-- sheepish (rborgo@gte.net), April 22, 2000

Answers

Just moving it to the other board so hopefully someone will see it.

-- sheepish (rborgo@gte.net), April 22, 2000.

We always worm with Valbazen when we bring new stock in, get a wider spectrum of wormers. 6cc per 100 pounds, don't guess their weight, use a weight tape. We would also inject 1cc per 110 pounds of Ivermectin 1% under the skin, to get lice, mites, and nose bots. This is the only use of injecting ivermectin for goats, to worm with it you give it at 2cc per 100 pounds by mouth. We trim thier feet, give 2cc of Bar Vac CD&T. 21 days later they receive all of the above. Their second set of vaccinations, a second worming, a great feeling when they have gained weight! Re Ivermected to catch the eggs hatching, and this is when we pull blood for CAE. We also would not bring these guys in with any scars or lumps on their lymph glands, neck, brisket, belly, rearlegs, same place we have lymph glands. If the tests come back negative, takes about a week, then we would introduce them to other stock. If they were to have CL they usually not always will have a lump appear during this quarentine period because of the stress of the move.

Wethers do not need alfalfa hay, to much protein and to much calcium. A good grass hay and perhaps a pound of grain per day would be o.k.. Try to get some of the feed that they are used to, make any changes slowly. We always have our feed mixed with ammonium chloride, this will prevent the problem of urinary calculi from the get go!, you can find excellent sheep feeds that have it in it already, be really leary of Goat feed, and anything that has animal products or by-products, or animal fat in it. You can put out some loose minerals (cattle) for them and that's about all except plenty of clean water. You can purchase ammonium chloride at pipevet.com it is cheap, comes in 5 pound bags for 4$. You will just sprinkel 1 tsp per buck in the feed once a day, tastes like salt. A much better book for information is caprinesupply.com their book Goat Keeping 101 it is a recently written book, not from the 60's. Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), April 22, 2000.

Thanks Vicki,

I will also get a newer book!

-- sheepish (rborgo@gte.net), April 22, 2000.

Sheepish, I missed this question. Did you get the goats? How are they looking? I run my goats with a sheep. No problems, actually, the sheep trails behind them like me, too, me, too.

When you trimmed the hooves did it look like they would be relatively straight, ever? Two of my new old angoras have uncorrectable hooves. The quick is just growing abnormally now, and no amount of trimming will help.

An update would be nice. Have they gained weight?

-- Rachel (rldk@hotmail.com), May 06, 2000.

Rachel, they are arriving tomorrow...so I haven't had a chance to do anything other than put up fence, and build a shelter for them...which my wonderful husband of 18 years (as of tomorrow) has assisted graciously.

I am pretty anxious about these guys. They looked more or less sound , but I'm a goat newbie. They will be in quarantine for at least a month. One thing I am sure of is that they will get lots of TLC. I have already chosen names for them: Siegfried and Roy...is that just a West Coast name or do you guys recognize it? The two guys with the white tigers that do magic shows in Las Vegas!

I will probably be posting goat questions, so thanks for bringing this up again. I don't think goatish sounds too good, so will stay with sheepish as my handle...!!

-- sheepish (rborgo@gte.net), May 06, 2000.

Sheepish, might want to rethink the month. Some of the diseases that goats carry are 21 days, even lice will rehatch out eggs in that amount of time. You really want to vaccinate, worm etc. And then redue all of this in 21 days, and then evaluate their health during this time, then let them out of the pen. You don't want a whole new batch of resistant worms from another persons herd on your property, or even hoof trimmings from someone elses property that has hoof rot, or pink-eye, sore mouth, lice (why we body shave newbies, and all of our does each spring) or pasturellla, etc. Because we run blood tests also, we quaranteen 90 and 120 days, depending upon if they are purchased for export or personal keeping. Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), May 06, 2000.

Siegfried and Roy! You will have to make them colorful satin capes and teach them to catch bullets in their teeth, etc. Love the names. I hope you enjoy their company as much as I do my goats.

-- Rachel (rldk@hotmail.com), May 06, 2000.

Good idea, Vicki. I'll keep them in for a couple of months or so. Ok here's today's goat newbie question(s): are they supposed to shed? Do you curry them? These guys look like they are shedding cottonwood fluff underneath their regular coats. (???) And, can you tell if they have enough weight on them by the "backbone" method, like sheep? Sheep standards can be determined by the back of your hand, knuckles, etc. Or should I buy a tape? Their ribs aren't showing, but I don't know how fat they should be. One is about 125 lbs, the other more like 100, we guess. Is that enough for a Nubian?

So far, they are settling in...eating blackberry bushes, and nibbling a little of the hay that their last owner brought to share. They are very curious about the other animals, which they can see, but not be close to. Ducks and chickens seem very foreign. One of them, Siegfried, makes a high pitched sound, kind of not what I would expect a goat to sound like..more like a whine!

Thanks for your help. Sun is shining and a beautiful day here. Last night was the first recorded frost this late in our area! Usually gone by 4/15.

-- sheepish (rborgo@gte.net), May 07, 2000.

Beautiful sunny day in Texas, we Bar-B-Qued! Ribs, corn and garlic bread, even cucumbers from the garden in the salad! Now I am just showing off! Yes they shed their winter coat, the wooly part is angora undercoat. My mostly black does have this, and when shaved in Feb. for the Livestock show, can almost appear white, we curry it out of them, though I use a dog brush made of pins, think its called a slicker brush. The bloodline of bucks that I breed POTF, don't have big voices. The gals can scream, and holler like normal, but the bucks sort of squeak. We have no idea why this is. We have tried lots of things to help them shed out faster, but we just shave them down. Some really creepy things can live in that undercoat.. You really ought to get yourself a weight tape, though I have had Nubains since 1986, when we got our boers, I was way off on guessing their weight, same with the ewe's we kept for awhile. I check for correct fleshing , and at our farm, excessive fleshing, by running my hand over the ribs. Dairy goats like dairy cattle carry lots of bone over their rump, part of diary character. Like to have a nice layer of flesh over my does and bucks ribs, now when it starts turning into a roll, or love handle, thats a little much! We will feel ribs with no flesh when our does are about 3 weeks fresh, they are simply milking to much for the calories they can consume. But about 12 weeks fresh things seem to calm down and they start putting on weight. With you feeding them and worming them, they will really start to look good in about 3 weeks. Especially with the additon of BOSS (black oil sunflower seeds) Don't kill them with kindness though, think of your grain as secondary, hay and browse are the most important! Sounds like these animals were very lucky to have found you! Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), May 07, 2000.

sheepish, don't worry unduly -- if you can take care of your sheep, you can manage the goats! And Vicki is a real asset, with lots of good advice. You'll be fine, and so will your goats! I had heard of Siegfried and Roy, sort of, but wouldn't have remembered who they were if you hadn't mentioned it. But then I'm from the West Coast originally -- and on the other hand, we don't have TV, so tend to be really out of it about a lot of things!! (What a blessing!!)

-- Kathleen Sanderson (stonycft@worldpath.net), May 07, 2000.

Well, here it is, some months later, and Siegfried and Roy are doing quite well! However, as a newbie with these Nubies, I am now concerned about keeping them warm in cold weather! My sheep are nicely fleeced and pretty well fleshed out but that's all I know about. The goats are looking good, too, but now that the temperatures are getting lower, I wonder what I might need to do. This weekend and early next week, the nighttime lows could hit single digits (Farenheit). That's cold for around here. Do I need to do anything special? Thanks for your help!!

-- sheepish (rborgo@gte.net), December 08, 2000.

I have heard Vicki and others saying they put old sweatshirts on their goats if it is way cold. My goats are all fuzzy now for the winter, they really have a good coat of hair. Dry bedding is important, if your knees get wet when you kneel down, it's too wet. (from Vicki) Just dry straw and out of the cold wind. I put a tarp over the doorway into the goat barn, and they go thru it. It sure cuts down the wind comming in, and it's warm in there. It's cold here too, but is warming up this week.

-- Cindy in Ky (solidrockranch@msn.com), December 09, 2000.

Though it is spring, I hope your two wethers weathered the winter. I have read in David MacKenzie's "Goat Husbandry" not to make the mistake of feeding extra grain for cold weather as you might do for other animals. This (I understood better than I can explane) creates a... just put it this way, A low grade field fodder/ruffage or hay keeps the goat warm without having to increase any grain intake. When it's cold down here (in Texas we say it's fixin to get cold) I give my goats extra hay. And of course, as Vicki recommended with housing.

-- Lisa Gail (ten4wardjazz@hotmail.com), April 05, 2002.

Hi Lisa,

The goats are now (still!) at "summer camp" from last summer (2001)! They were invited by some folks we know to move to their place to help clear blackberries (20 acres of them) in exchange for a nice warm barn, pasture, horses to hang out with, and lots of love and attention. The folks they are "staying with" are experienced with all kinds of livestock.

Since we are out of browse (our blackberries are gone), I'm happy that they have a place to stay for a while (and maybe even forever!)

It seems like it's working out well for everyone. And of course, I still have my sheep, chickens, geese, ducks, and cats for company...

Thanks for your post.

-- sheepish (WA) (the_original_sheepish@hotmail.com), April 05, 2002.