I have a 1 year old English Springer spaniel neutered male who has a horrible skin problem. He has always mildly itched, but just recently he has been going crazy itching, scratching patches of hair out. I've recently changed his food and maybe that could be it. I changed his food back and bathed him with an anti itch shampoo, applied skin balms etc. What I would like to know is that if anyone has any remedies for seriously itchy skin, anything alternative to prednisone(a steroid that I am trying to avoid). Thanks in advance Cara Lewis cnllewis@email.com

-- cara lewis (cnllewis@email.com), July 05, 2000

Answers

Dogs can have these types of problems due to food allergies or poor nutrition. You did not mention what you are feeding the dog. Do not feed him a cheap dry dog food. Most of these consist of corn husk for filler which just passes through and does nothing to give the dog the nutrition it needs. I suggest you start feeding this dog raw organ meat, beef, poultry or whatever. Liver and heart come to mind. Also raw free range eggs and raw milk if they are available. A good quality dog food usually costs a minimum of $1.00 a pound (Biljac or Eagle Pack are high quality). Many of the organ meats can be purchased for less. If you are worried about worms, you can freeze the meat for two weeks and then thaw it and warm it a bit, but it should not be cooked. Raw meats have a higher nutritional value than cooked. For a very good article on this subject go to http:// www.dreamscape.com/grccny/food_html.html Let us know how your dog does.

-- R. (thor610@yahoo.com), July 05, 2000.

Fleas???

-- ~Rogo (rogo2020@yahoo.com), July 05, 2000.

My old cocker spaniel itched a lot due to naturally dry skin. It was always worse during the summer, and I finally had to start bathing her in a tub that had had a cooled pan of oatmeal (about 6 servings) added to the warm water and mixed in. It kind of soothed the skin. I also had to start adding 1/4" of olive oil to her food, to up the fat in her diet, so that she would have oil for her skin. I've heard that an egg a day will help with that also, but these will only work if it is NOT due to a skin parasite.

If you check closely and find that hairs are breaking off easily at the base, your pup may have mites, and will require a viniger rinse to kill them, if they are the commen variety. I seem to recall that you have to leave the viniger (apple cider viniger) on for 10 full minutes before rinsing. Be careful though, if his skin is dry, it will burn him badly. Be sure to check first. I don't know any more about mites, though

-- Marty P. (mrs.Puck@excite.com), July 05, 2000.

One of the big seasonal skin problems we see in dogs is contact dermatitis due to whatever vegetation they're brushing through or sleeping in at the time. The biggest offender in Australia is an introduced weed called "Wandering Jew" - a feral (yes, again) flowering plant of the Genus "tradescantia". A quick search showed you have several varieties in the USA, and from memory about mid- summer would be when they flower. It may not be that plant, but I'd look at what plants the dog may be coming in contact with, and try to clean up or fence away any suspects. N.B. It could be a combination - contact dermatitis plus fleas, for instance - that's common. A lot of people believe brewer's yeast in the dog food raises resistance to fleas, too.

-- Don Armstrong (darmst@yahoo.com.au), July 05, 2000.

Hogs have naturally dry skin. I have my pet hog on a product that keeps his skin supple. There's directions on the bucket or bag for every critter. The product is available in feed stores or catalogs like Jeffers. It's Clovite. If anyone wants to know the ingredients, I'll post them.

-- ~Rogo (rogo2020@yahoo.com), July 05, 2000.

Thanks for the info so far!! To answer the first question He was fed Ol'Roy when I bought him and he was mildly irritated, so I switched him to a food that was reccomended by my feed dealer for his condition. It did nothing but get worse. He is bald around his eyes, flanks , hindquarters, and beginning on his sides. We recently moved from our house to my parents' house until we move to our permanent home in Maine next week. I'm wondering if the stress of moving to newsurroundings could have contributed to his problem. He has no fleas, ticks occasionally (coming from New Jersey, the tick capital of the world) I'm leaning toward the food allergies after reading the article:www.dreamscape.com/grccny/food_html.html recommended by my first response(sorry I don't remember the name and I can't get back to look it up. Thank You !!!!) Luckily I have alot of scrap meat left over from a steer and three pigs that we just butchered to feed this poor skin ailing dog. Still, any more advice is greatly appreciated!!

-- cara lewis (cnllewis@email.com), July 05, 2000.

Cara, My dog used to get an itch problem from time to time -- usually around this time of the year. It wasn't fleas. It was an allergy. I don't really know what he was allergic to (altho the vet suggested he was allergic to 'grass', very common according to him). I learned at the first sign of his itching starting up I would bring him in for an "allergy shot" -- I don't know what it was they gave him, but that is what the vet called it. One shot and it was done for the season! It did not seem to adversely affect him in anyway and the itching/scratching stopped almost immediately. (Beware that if he has been itching for a while he may continue to scratch for awhile due to habit, even after the shot -- so you should remind him NOT to scratch). Hope this helps you out.

-- Ed (shooter@keepandbeararms.com), July 05, 2000.

One more thing, I used to get a very long lecture from my vet about bathing him. The bottom line was DON'T. Bathing will dry out his skin more than anything no matter how much other "stuff" like oils, shampoos, etc. you put in with it. I was told ONCE per year for a bath was the maximum -- and never while he was having an itching problem. Good luck.

-- Ed (shooter@keepandbeararms.com), July 05, 2000.

The shot was probably a steroid..great for calming down a horrible itch, but does not solve the cause....do you think a quick trip to the vet could be possible to rule out mange before you move???? Some dogs have chronic mange because it was not properly diagnosed to begin with....God bless....(and enjoy your move!!!! )

-- Lesley (martchas@gateway.net), July 05, 2000.

You've asked for even more advice. Here's mine. Stop guessing. Take the dog to the vet for a proper diagnosis. If one vet doesn't help, go to another. Get the dog some help so he can get some relief. My 2"! :-)

-- ~Rogo (rogo2020@yahoo.com), July 05, 2000.

You've had some good advice, maybe the best was a trip to a vet. I've had some experience with Demodectic mange. It's hereditary, not contagious. Apparently it's on all dogs, but only affects some,(opportunistic) and mostly at times of stress, such as growth spurts, sexual maturity and cycling, and moving. My Border Collie had a brief bout with it when we got her at 11 mos. I responded because you mentioned hair loss around the eyes, which is really classic of demodex. Feet are also affected often, and lips. It can be anywhere on the body, especially if allergies or itching habits are involved.

Mild cases may go away on their own. Mine did. Don't change food again, that's stress too. Did he already have it when you got him? It can be treated with Ivomectrin, but there are other (very expensive) drugs your vet will prefer! If he prescribes one, ask about Ivomec. There are some nasty dips they might prescribe too, if he's that bad. If you can't afford a vet, most groomers would recognize classic demodex, and if it's bad he could stand to be shaved anyway.

Allergies are a real possibility, as are hot spots. I've heard from other groomers that Murphy's oil soap works great on hot spots, never had the need to try it. I use aveeno oatmeal mixed in a hypoallergenic shampoo to make cheap oatmeal shampoo. I think if you had a food mill that would grind oatmeal to powder, you could make your own aveeno! It's very soothing, and you can make a spritz or paste to use between bathings of it too. (I'm a groomer, BTW) There are tons of cheap home concoctions for all that expensive dog product!

Good Luck and let us know if you get a vet diagnosis, Jill

-- Jill Schreiber (schreiber@santanet.com), July 06, 2000.

Does your doggie have alot of pink skin? Contact dermatitis can be more severe for a fair skinned animal. From your description of the locations, it sounds like it could be vegetation that he is running through.

Grass allergy would show up on the belly first, then spread. Do you have wild parsnip there? Poison sumac, ivy or oak? Perhaps nettles?

Does he get plenty of exercise, swimming and hunting? Springers that are cooped up too much can get nervous and fidgety, chewing and scratching minor irritations making them worse.

I agree that a visit to the vet is a must to rule out mange or ringworm or other icky contagious stuff.

-- Laura (gsend@hotmail.com), July 06, 2000.

This question is for Jill the groomer. You mentioned Ivomectin for a treatment for demodex, but in what form? The more I look at my dog the more I am convinced that he does have demodex. I have seen it in short haired breeds before, in between toes and around the eyes, and he looks like a long haired version of that. Thanks everyone for your replies. Cara cnllewis@email.com

-- cara lewis (cnllewis@email.com), July 06, 2000.

Hi, I had a Border Collie Aussie Springer mix that had terrible skin problems. He would literrally eat holes in his feet and get lick granuloma....and have to wear one of those "dog from mars" collars just to stop him from injuring himself more. I finally got it all under control by making him food, rice, hamburger, canned vegetables, potatos, eggs, and mixing that with a high quality rice and lamb dog food. I laced peanut oil over it as well. I found that bathing him every two weeks with dandruff shampoo followed with aussie mega conditioner kept him happy and therefore I was happy. If he contacted some plant that irritated him badly I would give him 1/2 a tablet of Benadryl.

The vets always prescribed prednisone and would give him a shot of cortisone. I didn't like all of that stuff as it can cause other complications down the road. The above really worked well and even though it seems like a lot, once you get into the routine it isn't all that bad. Good luck.

-- Doreen (livinginskin@yahoo.com), July 07, 2000.

Cara, Our pink skinned hound has a similar problem and I have been bathing her rash areas with a fresh squeezed aloe and water solution. I have been using this treatment for about a month and her scratching and gnawing has been minimal. Hope this can be of help.

Jay Blair (jayblair678@yahoo.com)

-- J. Blair Gee (jayblair678@yahoo.com), July 08, 2000.

When I lived in Ohio my neighbor's persian cat came down with mange. Vet clipped all the hair they could to the skin. Can you imagine a cat looking like a newly clipped poodle? Cat also had to be bathed ever so often with some type of medicated shampoo. She had me do it. Bathing a cat isn't all that much fun and the shampoo had to be kept on for something like ten minutes.

-- Ken Scharabok (scharabo@aol.com), July 09, 2000.

You won't believe this...but, I have watched many dogs and cats totally recover from this itching by giving them Fish Oil!! You can buy the capsules in any grocery store or drug store, squeeze the oil on his food and there you go!! I gave 3 a day until I saw some improvement, then started cutting down from there. good luck! sissy

-- sissy sylvester (jerreleene@hotmail.com), July 09, 2000.

A convenient source for organ meat is chicken gizzards at the supermarket. My two barn mousers get one a day. I just freeze them separated in a zip-lock bag until I need them, then thaw them out. For the cats I cut them in pieces, but a dog should be able to gulp whole.

-- Ken Scharabok (scharabo@aol.com), July 09, 2000.

I raise goldens which can also have skin problems heres what I do .Do switch dog food .Go to a all chicken or lamb and rice food such as nutro max .It will cost more but it will help , it's one of the only ones without corn, byproducts or beef added .Its also very high in needed acids for healthy skin .Start giving vit e and brewers yeast .It will take a little time to start working.It might be wise to do a round of drugs to make him more comfortable .

-- Patty Gamble (fodfarms@slic.com), July 10, 2000.

Well, here's one more. We switched to an all turkey & rice food and have seen dramatic improvement and healthy weight gain in our collie mix. VF complete veterinary formula. No suspicious stuff in it. Have your feed store order it.

-- Jean (schiszik@tbcnet.com), July 10, 2000.

Thanks all for your responses, all were appreciated. I finally had to take the dog to the vet because he was going to lose all his hair. He tested negative for demodex mites and any mange. The vet said that he is severely allergic to ????. He had a cortisone shot , was placed on antibiotics, antihistamines, ear, eye, etc. medicine. He was classified as a complete allergic disaster. Luckily, it didn't cost as much as I thought. My question tonight is : has anyone heard of the fish and potatoes diet, which was recommended by my vet, or anything close to it? She said that his condition could be seasonal as is all of our allergies, or it could just be the beginning of the end. I would like to stop it now, with whatever I can to make his life as comfortable as possible. Thanks again for all your help!!! cnllewis@email.com

-- cara lewis (cnllewis@email.com), July 10, 2000.

They can have the same allergys as us !I would try lamb and rice first .It has always worked for us .Look at label , as I said I found Nutro Max to be the best .No corn,beef and so on .Start with vitamens to boost his system .

-- Patty Gamble (fodfarms@slic.com), July 11, 2000.

The fish and potato is fine. What you need to do is to narrow down what the allergies are to and you can only do that by yourself. Some dogs have problems with a particular starch source. Cook up a big pot of rice and add fish and eggs to it..then give that a full week and then maybe add potatos, also, some canned veggies would be good, like green beans, but address the nutritional needs first then work out the ingredients and figure out what he's reacting so harshly to. This will take time. Cheap dog foods cost more money in the long run in vet bills. Good luck.

-- Doreen (livinginskin@yahoo.com), July 11, 2000.

I worked for a vet several years ago and what you are describing could very well be mange. We normally treated this with injectable ivermectin. Also, we bathed dogs with a pine tar pet shampoo. Smelled weird but was very soothing to their skin. Some dogs do have various allergies and it can be their food, but could also be pollin, grass, weeds, your carpet, fleas, etc. I personally wouldn't recommend Ol Roy brand but if other feeds make him worse I'd stick with it for now!

-- Elle (hotging@aol.com), July 12, 2000.