I have pygmie goats, 6 mths old. How do I know when to breed them? I currently have them all together and have not seen anything going on , other then alot of butting, especially of the smaller ones. It seems the smaller ones get picked on by the bigger ones. :-( Anyway, I have someone wanting to buy my billy when he has bred the girls (4 girls, one boy) , but I need to know when he is done. I told the guy I THOUGHT I would be done with him by October...any help would be appreciated!

Cindy

-- Cindy Cluck (ldsmomof6@yahoo.com), August 13, 2000

Answers

Hi Cindy, I wouldn't be suprised if those babies were already bred. It's best to wait to breed them until they are much older, I would recommend separating the buck from the does until they are closer to a year old or even a bit older. I've had my buck get in with my young does at 7 months and I would never recommend breeding at that age. There are drugs you can give to end the pregnancys to give the does time to grow and mature but I have no experience with them. I'm sure someone on the forum has info about it though. It would be awful to lose your goats during delivery because they were too young. Good luck

-- Julie (julieamc@excite.com), August 13, 2000.

I know very little about Pygmies and when they should be bred, except that my friend's pygmies are always having terrible birthing problems, needing C-sections, etc. It also kind of depends on your climate and whether or not pygmies come into heat out of season. Around here, they come into heat in September, and the bucks are run with the does until mid August (they're descented, so no smell). It would be a good idea to seperate the smaller does from the bullies so they can grow well.

-- Rebekah (daniel1@transport.com), August 15, 2000.

I have had Pygmies for about 10 years & have only had problems with 2 kiddings. I wait until they're at least 10 months old, depends on size, but like to wait until they're at least a year. I would also tend to think they may be bred already which is way too young. IMO. I'm in Indiana & mine come in heat all year long. I've had kids born in almost every month of the year. They aren't as seasonal as the dairy breeds. I would suggest seperating them, but it's probably too late for that already.

-- Wendy (weiskids@yahoo.com), August 15, 2000.

The most common drug to abort a doe is lutelyse. It's safe and effective and beats pulling a huge single buck kid out of an 11 month old doe all to pieces. You have to get it from a vet. Be sure to speak to him/her about the safety of the person injecting the goat. I have heard conflicting information that it can have the same effect on a pregnant woman or one on birth control.

-- marilyn (rainbow@ktis.net), August 15, 2000.

Ok..I am so confused..everyone I talked to locally said I would have mean goats if I did not breed them before 6 mths of age, so I ran out and bought me a billy, which I was not going to to until they were a year old....now I am being told that they may die. :-( Is there anyway to tell if they are pregnant or not?

Cindy

-- Cindy Cluck (ldsmomof6@yahoo.com), August 16, 2000.

I recently met a lady who raises pigmies, and she said she waits till they are one year old. I have two pigmy doelings that are five months old. They came in heat their first time about a month ago. So hopefully your little ladies haven't come in heat yet, because pigmy billies are quite ready and willing a lot younger than that.

-- Lela Picking (Stllwtrs55@aol.com), August 16, 2000.

my doe got bred way to early she was 6 mon. old the billy got out and found her, the "birth" was the worst thing i have ever seen. she went in to labor at night and i did not know i went out in the am to find a very large leg hanging out the vet came and had to remove the baby . i will not go into details , please seperate asap and call a vet to check them.

-- renee oneill (oneillsr@home.com), August 17, 2000.

There is no way to tell, even a vet, if a young doe is bred. It is a 50/50 guess at best. Your best bet is to 1. ultrasound the doe, if she is bred Lutilyse her, a 2cc muscle shot will abort her in 36 hours and if she isn't bred will just bring her into heat. An abortion at this stage of the game would be nothing more than a discharge, you would have to be right there to even see the kids the size of small shrimp. 2. Just Luitlyse her anyway, this will save you the cost of the ultrasound, and also if the person using the machine is not very experienced the information could be incorrect anyway. No matter what you do not want this pregnancy to come to term, you will be lucky if it turns out with healthy mom and kid. Especially in pygmy, with short square kids, at least if it was dairy, you would be talking long kids, much eaiser to deliver. Lots of folks put their own moral values onto their animals, so this may not be an option for you. Good luck in your decision, whatever you choose to do we will be here to help you, but make your decision now. Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), August 17, 2000.

I have just finished revising the 25-year-old Raising Milk Goats the Modern Way (Storey Books) and although not everyone thinks we writers know everything (and rightfully so) here are my observations:

 Breed by weight, not by age. A goat that has been growing well should be ready to breed when shes 3/4 her mature weight, which should be 6-8 months.  African or tropical goats (Pygmies and Nigerians) can be expected to breed earlier, and more out of season, than the more common dairy breeds.  If theyre all together, you wont necessarily see anything going on. (In my old marine corps parlance, its a wham, bam, thank you mam sort of thing.) But your question about when to breed is really moot.If theyre six months old, and youve had a buck running with them, they are almost certainly bred.

-- Jd (belanger@tds.net), August 19, 2000.

Ok, I kept the little bitty girl away from the other goats because they kept picking on her. She has not been with the billy, but the ones that have reached full size (almost) have been with my billy (he is gone now). I have turned breach calves, helped deliver when the full sized goats kidded when I was a teen... helped with countless cats and dogs delivery etc...so I am going to let them go to term and see what happens. I hope sincerely that the billy did not get to the littlest one, since she is so tiny. I will call the vet and get the shot for her, just in case. She was in a totally different pen, but would sneak out now and then. I hope that I do not regret this decision, but I am going to hang on to my experiences with animals in the past and present and go with it. Thanks so much for the advice!!!

Cindy

-- Cindy Cluck (ldsmomof6@yahoo.com), August 20, 2000.

HI Cindy, We will all be praying your goats come thru this ok. Something to think about, we have a homestead dairy goat herd, don't show, so we breed our does to kid in March. We are in Kentucky and it does get very cold here, and we would rather have kids after the coldest months are over. My barn is not toasty warm, but it is fine for the grown ones in the winter. My does don't need a buck till Oct. 1st. And we don't breed this years little girls, we wait till next year. Just our preference, as Saanens will grow much larger if not bred the first year. Only 5 are being bred now, for earlier kids so I can milk year round. If they all kid at the same time there isn't much milk for you. Hang in there, Cindy

-- Cindy in KY (solidrockranch@msn.com), August 21, 2000.

We breed our dairy does (alpines) as early as 5-6 months, and they grow just fine if they are well fed, that means good hay and grain,too. What you don't want to do is to get a young doe bred and then underfeed her, on poor hay and no grain. You will get a skinny, stunted mother, and tiny, weak kids. If you feed them well, they will keep right on growing and milk better throughout their lifetime than if you had waited an extra year. As for getting mean if they weren't bred young, where do people come up with these stories?! Fat, maybe, but they won't get mean from being held over a year. You might want to have a vet lined up ahead of time for the does that you are not going to lutelyse. Though, if it were me, I'd do them all, and rebreed the ones that were big enough and old enough, just so I'd be sure they were bred, and when they were due.

-- Rebekah (daniel1@transport.com), August 22, 2000.