I couldn't help but wonder if anyone else noticed the historic significance of Mark giving up Susan's Apartment. Is there any greater symbolic gesture to let Elizabeth [and us] know that he's very devoted to this girl?

I don't think there's been any more dramatic location on the show outside of the hospital itself. Can anyone think of one?

-- John (lloydsouth@cs.com), October 20, 2000

Answers

There was a certain amount of symbolism there. I don't think that Elizabeth was around for the Susan years, so maybe she isn't as aware of what it means for Mark as the viewers do. It was a nice thing for the viewers to see, though, this maturation of Mark. Plus, he has wonderful taste in houses!

It seemed to me that there was an awful lot of dramatic things that went on at Carol's house as well. We have seen the homes of other characters, but it has always seemed that Susan's apartment and Carol's house have been the "off-duty" places that TPTB have highlighted. Hopefully we will see a little bit more of the personal lives of the other characters in places other than the hospital.

As an aside, I thought the proposal scene was beautiful. Giving her a house and ring all at once. Gotta love Dr. Greene.

Laura

-- Laura (ulaks@goldengate.net), October 20, 2000.

The most dramatic location outside of the hospital is probably around the lake. Everyone either had exercised or had some sort of epiphany by the lake at one point or another. For instance, Doug and Mark said their goodbyes at the lake. Actually, if you don't include it as part of the hospital proper, the roof has always been one of those "special places" everyone goes to smoke or have blurt out their feelings. I'm afraid of heights, so I would prefer the lake myself...

I agree though that Susan's apartment has been one of the great dramatic places outside of the hospital. I always wondered why Mark still lived there even though he became an attending many seasons ago. Now I realize he was just living cheap so he could afford that dream house!

-- Derek (derekmoore18@hotmail.com), October 20, 2000.

I think some of the most poignant scenes EVER on ER have happened at Doc Magoo's....when Raul died, when Lucy died, Carter's conversation with Abby last night and many, many more!

-- amanda (amanda.rehm@home.com), October 20, 2000.

I noted the symbolism too...it is time for him to move on with his life: he's over Susan, over his beating and this is also a way of trying to get over his parents death. I was amazed that he could afford the house, even if he's "sharing expenses" with Liz, because he almost always uses the same clothes (remember the brown coat he always wear in formal ocassions?) and he lives in a trashy-looking place I always assumed that he wasnt in a good financial situation. I wonder how much he still owes in student payments. The house is beautiful. I didnt see the ring clearly, but I liked Liz facial expression. =)

-- jules (jules@operamail.com), October 20, 2000.

Don't forget Gamma's kitchen! There were also some pretty emotional scenes in California for the "Fathers and Sons" episode--Mark's parent's house and the hotel/boarding house where Doug's father had been staying when he died.

-- Annie (GoldenLaur@aol.com), October 20, 2000.

About being able to afford the house: remember Mark said he was "living cheap". Which I took to mean he kept Susan's apartment not for financial reasons, but rather he didn't see any reason to move. Also, remember, his last parent recently died, and it looks like he's an only child. Guess who probably got the estate? (I'm assuming, of course that his parents weren't dumb enough to die intestate.) There was at least one asset that it would appear that Mark was responsible for. Do we remember? His parents house. Recall that he planned to sell it. A house makes a nice down payment on another house. Especially a California house.

I also recently read that Emergency Physicians make on average 100 grand a year. Not the highest paid, (that's Radiology) but they don't do too bad.

So Mark could definitely afford the house.

-- S. Trelles (trelles@ix.netcom.com), October 20, 2000.

Right, I forgot he was supposed to sell the house in California, at least that's what he said before crying...Good, I wouldnt like them to go trought the same problemas that Carol did with her house, remember?

-- jules (jules@operamail.com), October 20, 2000.

Quote: I'm assuming, of course that his parents weren't dumb enough to die intestate.

Even if they did, most states have statutes setting out the survivor's rights to the estate. As their only heir, Mark would probably get the bulk of the estate regardless.

Back on topic, I found myself wondering if Carter would take over Susan's place. He was looking for new digs near the end of Season 6, just before he went to rehab.

-- Beth (bsmith@internet-95.com), October 20, 2000.

Okay, first of all, let me say that all day long I was thinking that I needed to start a thread here that started out "No More Susan's Apartment" but was afraid that nobody would care. So I am glad that great minds think alike! It is after all only a set, but it has been around (I think we saw more of it when Susan lived there but it did look nicer with Mark's stuff.)

As for where the most dramatic stuff takes place (outside of the hospital itself), gotta be the ambulance bay.

-- KJ (KristijohnsonSD@aol.com), October 21, 2000.

I was also going to start a post about this-- I guess most "ER" fans think alike! And this probably will be the end of Susan's apartment, which also signifies and end in "ER" history. Mark is finally moving on with his life-- I don't think he actually still loves Susan, I think he moved on from that a while ago, but it has so many other connotations involved with it. Susan's apartment is just one more aspect of the show that's been in it form the beginning and is going to leave. I love the new house, though, it's beautiful!

And, on the important places outside of the hospital topic, I think Susan's apartment and Carol's house were probably the two most significant houses of characters, and Doc Magoo's is the most important place where characters get together. But that's JMHO!

I think that the proposal scene was one of the sweetest and happiest we've seen on the show for a long time, except for maybe some of "Such Sweet Sorrow," which was still very bittersweet. And "AITF" was amazing, but it certainly wasn't very happy... I loved the look on her face when she said "Yes." :-)

~Jessica~

-- Jessica (princessleia913@excite.com), October 21, 2000.

I for one did not even think about this, though I'm more prone to remember some glimmer of Doug and Carol, now that it's been mentioned, I guess I kind of wish her apartment were still in the show now, as a momento...though there's always Carter's bathrobe! I highly doubt they will mention it in the show, unless Mark offers it to Carter (I like that idea!) and her name is mentioned. There'd be a lot of smiles if that ever happened. Although it did seem like they could move in pretty quickly..."as soon as your bags are packed."

I agree about Mark...he is the *head* of ER, and though hospital doctors get paid less than private practice, they've got to be doing okay! He's a doc, she's a surgeon. Mark just seems to not care about living cheap..."Mark, your toilet rocks..."I kind of like that"...(and one more adorable quote)..."what kind of creatures crawl in the walls!"..."Bunnies?") Not to mention he NEVER dresses up.

-- Elaine (mrsclooney78@hotmail.com), October 21, 2000.

Elaine, I too liked Mark's comeback about liking the fact that the toilet rocked. :) My first thought when Mark was showing Elizabeth the house was nice place, where'd the money come from? My second was, he sold his parents' house...which I'd assume was mortgage free. Must have done pretty good on it considering the house AND the rock in the freezer.

-- Diana (dilynne@juno.com), October 21, 2000.

I think Mark was trying to diffuse a tense situation by lightening the mood a little ... the "bunnies" comment was hilarious, and I think even if I'd been as stressed as Elizabeth I would have HAD to laugh at that one. I thought Mark was awesome in this epi, and I *LOVED* his proposal to Elizabeth. He is enlightened enough to say "... do me the honor of being your husband" ... how refreshing. I think he and Elizabeth are good for each other. :-)

-- Cindy (tailchasers51@hotmail.com), October 23, 2000.

Lovely scenes, and surprises apparently make good TV. Elizabeth is so touched by Mark's romantic gestures that she'll probably never say that she would have preferred to help choose the house and the ring. But she might think it, later at least. I would. Call me unromantic. Would be great if Carter gets Susan's apartment and its hordes of multilegged roommates.

-- Driad (driad@mailcity.com), October 23, 2000.

Actually, I would like to see Abby in Susan's apartment, because in her situation maybe she needs to save money. Do you think that Carters family could turn their backs on him so he 'd have to live in a cheap apartment? It was kind of fun when he was living poorly during season 4 and Doug invited him to eat burgers...

-- jules (jules@operamail.com), October 24, 2000.

Jules, I *loved* that! (i.e. Doug taking Carter out for beer and burgers). See, we need characters who interact w/ *all* of the other ones, not just a few. I had forgotten all about that scene until a few months ago and awaited it on reruns.

By the way, I enjoyed Carter while he was in his poor stage too...just because his apartment/dorm troubles gave him some funny short storylines. I know he needs support, but I hope he moves into his own place soon, or maybe he could room with Malluchi! (j/k...well actually.....)

-- Elaine (mrsclooney78@hotmail.com), October 24, 2000.

I know you meant it as a joke, but I think it could be a good idea to make Dave and Carter roomates, because they are so different that it could give them a lot of funny and dramatic lines. Imagine them in Susans apartment having an argument because of the way one of them treated a patient or something like that...or would that be too much like "Friends"? They are my second choice for Susan's apartment, after Abby.

-- jules (jules@operamail.com), October 24, 2000.

Elaine and Jules- I have to agree with you both about Carter and Dave being roommates in Susan's old apartment. That would be so cool and funny. We need a little humor in drama shows.

-- Cammie (rmaelhorn@home.com), October 24, 2000.

Just one problem with Dave and John being roommates. There is only one bedroom.

-- James (eorejim@aol.com), October 24, 2000.

Ok...forget the idea...I dont want them to get THAT together...=)...unless they get (what is the word?) one bed on top of the other.

-- jules (jules@operamail.com), October 24, 2000.

It's called a bunk bed. Wait a mintue though. If it only had one bedroom then where did Chloe sleep when she lived there with Susan.

-- Cammie (rmaelhorn@home.com), October 24, 2000.

When Chloe lived there she slept on one of those rollaway beds you would find in a hotel that was set up in the living room. You'll see it in the beginning of "Motherhood" and at the very beginning of "Union Station" the landlady tells Mark that"It is a great one bedroom," also at the end when Mark rushes through the empty apartment you get view of the layout.

-- James (eorejim@aol.com), October 24, 2000.