While assimilating the varying opinions here on practically everything.... are there any suggestions for the best coffee to drink during the process? I think Poole's detailed explanation of "more than you ever wanted to know about coffee" is the best read about a little understood pleasure in life.

-- Anonymous, November 28, 2000

Answers

Well, I can't stand the stuff myself. However, I'm the chief coffee maker for my wife, since she experiments, and ruins more than she drinks.

I don't drink the stuff, so I make it the same way every time. I don't care.

So, the formula she finds most pleasing runs about like this.

Take about two tablespoons of millstone columbian supremo beans. Grind finely in a small electric grinder. Put in plain white paper filter, in basket. Add eight cups of water to drip coffee maker, fire it off.

This seems a bit strong for most, she likes ice in her coffee so it comes out a little strong to account for the ice.

Folgers columbian beans are acceptable if the millstone isn't available. Cafe arabica only, please.

-- Anonymous, November 28, 2000

Maxwell House instant!

Nothin' like it :)

-- Anonymous, November 28, 2000

Ellis:

Like anything else, trial and error would be the best way to find the kind of coffe you yourself like. As Stephen I believe said in his essay, it is critical to get coffee roasted within 2 to 3 days of it being roasted. There is a now defunt web site which reviewed coffees for several years, www.coffeereview.com. the site and the reviews are still up, and you will find a treasure trove of ideas there, and many company names you can find over the internet who roast daily.

I personally like using a french press, grinding the beans in the morning and brewing it fresh. I have a particular fondness for High grade Kenyans and guatmalen coffee-though each coffee producing country produces winners.

-- Anonymous, November 28, 2000

I'm with Paul on this one. I don't drink the stuff. I had to laugh after I said I'd forgotten to bring coffee for Lucky to SO's daughter's Thanksgiving feast, as I learned later that we didn't have any coffee to bring. I don't know whether SO took it to his training class with him or whether he simply ran out, but I suppose I should buy some for when Lucky comes to dinner over the next holiday since he's flown back to the training class.

-- Anonymous, November 28, 2000

I had to switch to Maxwell House-Lite (1/2 the caffiene) due to acid- reflux problems. Honestly, can't tell the difference between that and whole(?) coffee.

Between that and Prevacid, life is much better.......

Deano

-- Anonymous, November 28, 2000

FS-

You and I are once again of the same mindset. I can't drink my coffee black, however, I have to have it with cream. And it has to be REAL cream, the fake stuff is too sugary and milk is too watery. Just a little dollop of cream mellows the coffee without watering it down.

-- Anonymous, November 28, 2000

After reading about whole bean Folgers in a thread a while back on one of our boards, I got some and ground it just before putting it in the Mr. Coffee. Just ran out, and have to find more. My Dad used a small round glass coffee post and had a little filter holder he put a paper filter into then a gold filter where the coffee grounds were placed. We would pour hot water over it, slowly, washing the grounds that stayed on the sides down to the center.

There was no acid in the coffee and it tasted great. But it only made two 1/2 cups of coffee.

-- Anonymous, November 28, 2000

It really is a matter of individual taste. I bought the Folgers whole bean this weekend as an emergency and it was next to awful. There was an obvious defect in the coffee, which I smelled even before I crushed a bean. In this case, the defect was almost like mildew, as if the beans were not dried properly.

You will never go back to supermarket coffee after drinking coffees from companies such as www.theroasterie.com. Give it a shot.

Tarzan:

Back at you. I drink mine the same way.

-- Anonymous, November 29, 2000

Yeah, I take a little creme in my coffee, too. My tea, though, is taken straight. I don't like creme in that.

FS,

You obviously got a bad bag of beans. That's a shame. The Folger's stuff isn't world class, but the Columbian and the Gourmet Supreme are quite drinkable.

The problem is, these supermarket chains buy in shipload quantities to get a better price, store the bagged coffee in central warehouses and then ship to the stores on demand. You very likely got a bag that was over a year old.(!)

Or, the coffee could have gotten damp. I didn't go into that too deeply in the article, but moisture is indeed an enemy (prior to brewing, of course). It'll cause the beans to spoil and go rancid, producing a brew that tastes ... well, like dookey. :)

-- Anonymous, November 29, 2000

Stephen:

I think you may be right. The Folgers was very close to being drinkable, but for that noticable defect. I admit to being a snob when it comes to coffee, but I will not close my mind forever to a supermarket brand-hey, sometimes you just run out of coffee and in my neighborhood there are no specialty dealers.

For those still following this thread, there is another specialtyu dealer, in Sag Harbor Long Island, New York, called "Java Nation"- excellant all around. I do not have the number, but use your favorite on line telephone directory and you will find it.

-- Anonymous, November 30, 2000

Since I'm into more than "drinkable" coffee, I buy an organically grown coffee. I recently learned from a person on a talk show, who is involved with Seattle Audubon Society (yes, they have this information on their web site, she says) that my coffee is "shade grown". Now this really sounds yuppeefied, but it pleased me to learn that the only way that coffee can be free of the normal ninety someodd deadly chemicals is if it's shade grown. This is because coffee plants, at least the ones native to the western hemisphere, are native to rainforests.

Unfortunately, some thirty or forty years ago (I don't remember just what she said), the big boys got into the coffee game, and decided it would be way cool to be able to raise more coffee beans in a shorter period of time by clearing the rain forests and planting coffee trees in the full sunshine. Problem was, the plants were less healthy, and therefore were more susceptible to diseases and insect attack, and also there were less predators available to eat the insects. (Not so many birds hanging around in a sunny coffee plantation, I suppose).

The other interesting thing about coffee grown in its more natural habitat is that it actually tastes like coffee. Unlike a lot of the stuff they call coffee at your local market.

Another plus is that many of the smaller coffee plantations which grow shade coffee are coops which sell directly to the distributors here in the states. The coop makes a more nearly living wage, and we get a better product. AND, it costs less than other "specialty coffees".

I get my coffee in Eugene Oregon, at Royal Blue Organics; It's grown in Chiapas, Mexico, by decendants of the Mayans. It's caled Cafe Mam, and it can also be found in other locations throughout the states, I'm told.

Bottoms up!

JOJ

-- Anonymous, December 01, 2000

The Mexican Coffee industry has improved dramatically in the last few years. The growers used to be paid on a quantity basis, but this has been switched to a quality basis. The organically grown coffees in Mexico, im my experience, are almost all good; this cannot be said about organics from other countries. I have been most impressed with the consistency in the Mexican Coffess-None of them are world class, but they are a very good brew overall.

-- Anonymous, December 01, 2000

You coffee connoisseurs would have enjoyed the coffee farm "tour" I was given while living in Panama. I had become friends with a Panamanian whose family had for generations owned one of the larger coffee "fincas" in the region. As the farm's foreman, he gave me a personal tour of the entire operation start to finish. It was actually quite interesting.

Couple observations:

Native Indians are hired to hand pick the beans. These Indian workers ranged in all ages from the very old to the very young. I recall being amazed as I watched a boy who couldn't have been more than 6 yrs old. He expertly wielded a machete-like knife non-stop while his little sister (maybe 3 yrs old) sat on the ground and clung to his leg. Apparently he was babysitting her. Quite a sight.

Deadly poisonous snakes are not at all uncommon in the fields. (My friend's grandfather had been killed by a "Bushmaster".)

During the harvest, these Indians stay on the farm in bare concrete block buildings which are provided by the owners. I was told that once, in an effort to make them more comfortable, my friend had installed couches and chairs in these buildings. The next day however, he discovered they had chopped up the funiture, preferring to use it as cook-stove firewood. Needless to say, they are quite primitive.

Coffe beans on the vine are sweet when you bite into them. (I didn't know that!)

At the mill, beans are seperated into different grades. The best beans are shipped out of the country (mainly to Italy in his case) which leaves only the lowest grade beans for domestic consumption.

My personal all-time favorite coffee... Jamaican

-- Anonymous, December 02, 2000

jumpoffjoe,

It's hard to imagine how pesticides could remain through the processing, especially under the "wet" method (most common in Central America), where the fruit is thoroughly washed and then left to ferment in water. The seeds are removed and milled and washed again prior to drying. Compare this to, say, the way that a tomato or orange or potato might be processed (they're only washed once or twice), and you'll see the difference.

But I can't argue with your choice. There's always the danger that pesticides make it in through the plant's vascular system, into the beans themselves.

One fine point, though. That lady is speaking of robustas and junk arabicas, not the finer coffees. If you visit the top plantations in Columbia and Guatemala, you'll see that the trees ARE still shaded. Without the shade, the coffee DOES lose flavor, so the "Estate Select" types ARE grown in shade, whether organically or not.

FutureShock,

I've had excellent Mexican and Panamanian coffees. They have improved in the past few decades. On the other hand, under pressure to produce, Columbian quality has declined.

Kenya also has a merit system, where growers are rewarded for quality, which is why its coffee is world-class.

-- Anonymous, December 02, 2000

Stephen:

I agree with you about the Panamanian coffees. The ones I have tried, in the last year, have been consistant. I also agree about the Columbian coffees; it is been difficult to find a good one in quite some time.

As stated before I love the Kenyans, and may I add that a good Kona can go a long, long way.

Costavike:

I cannot seem to acquire a taste for the Jamaicans; I guess I like an earthier coffee, with a heavier body, and the blue mountain coffees are much more subtle, and almost sweet to the taste bud. I just think they are cost prohibitive-$35-$45 per pund is just too much for my taste buds, especially when I have been blown away by $12/pound Antiguas.

-- Anonymous, December 03, 2000

Can anyone say "Starbucks"? Do you all have those near ya?

It IS to die for.

Maxwell house in am, hubby has it ready when I wake up...thanks honey, I luv you. *wink*

But, when I'm out on my own and all alone, nothing but a starbucks coffee latte will do....

Then I'm up for 12 hours. )))) sooooo worth it. ahhh.

-- Anonymous, December 03, 2000

Sumer:

You walked into my Starbucks rant and did not even know it!

Regardless of their success, they are not purveyors of fine coffee. most of the beans used to make your latte, or a cup of coffee are weeks, if not months old. When you have tasted a cup of coffee from beans roasted 12 hours ago, you will know forever the difference between what is COFFEE and what merely passes for the shit on the street.

This is not meant in any way to be an indictment of you, my friend- just a little nudge to find some place that roasts the beans fresh.

Add to that rant the fact that Starbucks burns the shit out of all their coffee-Every bean has its optimum roast level, mild to dark, but the folks at ol starbucks, outside of their "light note" blend, dark raost everything, destroying the subtle nuances of some of the beans.

But I give them credit; they have convinced America that dark roast is "better", and so they get away with their crude roasting methods.

Break away, sumer, break away.

-- Anonymous, December 03, 2000

Wow, you FS have enlightened me!!! I've been drinking starbucks and it is burnt? ewwwwwww!!!

I'll *try* to find some good coffee I promise.

-- Anonymous, December 04, 2000

Stephen, I don't pretend to be an expert on either pesticides or coffee. I do remember MANY years ago reading that SOMEBODY had done tests on coffee imported into the US, and found an average of ninety some-odd pesticides in levels large enough to register on their test equipment. Of these, about a third were "legal" to use in the US, a third were "illegal" to use here, and a third were "unknown" pesticides. Don't remember how they even knew they were pesticides. I suppose they were in a class of organophosphates, or whatnot, that were recognizable by type only. Maybe. It's been a long time...

JOJ

-- Anonymous, December 06, 2000