We just had a goat die from blaoting. It was a 4-6 week old Lamancha doe. It happened the day before i am posting this. This is what happened, between 7:30 and 8:00 P.M. it was getting feed her dinner of milk replacer (if it makes any difference it was Mana Pro Unimilk) after it was fead my mother made the comment that it looked bigger then normal. we thought nothing of it until around 10:00 pm it was still really big arond the stomach and solid like a water balloon (the kind that are half filled withe water and the other halv air). she would run around and jump like she would normally but once in a whild she would just topple over on to her side as if she was fainting, but she would be balling and laying there on her side. one time she rolled over and stuck her hoves in the air and looked like a turtle suck on it back and could not ge back up. about 11:00 or so we were worried that she was bloating but we did not know what to do, so we called a friend of ours. he said that it couldn't be bloating, but he told us to put some slight but constant presure on her sides and see if that releaves some of the pressure. we did that and she started to burp. her sides down but not to normal. half an hour she was swelled up again. we tried the pressure thing again but it did not work. she did go pee a couple of times durring this whole thing but not much. she was running arond th house and screamming, then all of the sudden she passed out and this time it was for real. my sister saw it happen, then she called me. i wnt straight to it and lifted it head thinking it was dead, it was not. it would not cry but it could feel it breating. this was at about midnight. we called our friend againg and told him that we were bringing it over to try to (i dont know the term but it is when you stick a neddle in it and lt the gas out). once we got in the car it was dead there was no breating her stomach felt like it was going to burst.

I dont know why i am saying the whole story, but i would like to know if anyone knows what would cause something like this to happen. and what causes it? how to take care of it when it does happen. what i should have on hand to help prevent it.

Thank you so very much. God Bless

-- David Horvath (hawkeye784@yahoo.com), May 02, 2001

Answers

Were you feeding her something else besides the milk replacer? If so how much ? If you were feeding her a pelleted feed also that may be the culprit, the only way we treat cattle for bloat is to stick a garden hose down their throat to relieve the gas, or stick a knife in their side, We try the hose first. for a goat you could use a teat needle and stick it in their side. this would surely take the gas off. In prevention, Sometimes bloat is caused by feed being too good. (to good of Hay being fed), (to good of complete Pelleted feed) I'm not sure of goats, We have a feedlot and see a few cases of bloat in our cattle a year. Hope this helps..

-- Debi (iowaranchgal@yahoo.com), May 02, 2001.

Hi,

I am so sorry to hear of you loss. That sounds as if it was a horrible situation for you. Be careful feeding milk replacer to kids as this can happen. I do not feed replacer to our kids because of the problems that can happen such as with your kidds. I had a dear friend who fed milk replacer to their kids a few years back and they lost most of their kid crop from it. Some milk replacers are good, i have heard folks having good luck with the one that is specially designed for goats, think hoeggers sells it. One of the signs of problems with feeding milk replacers or even whey to kids is the swelling of their stomachs after eating. They just don't get the necessary nutritional requirements they need at such a young and critical age. For treatments for bloat there is a new product out available form Jeffers which helps, can't remember the name but i think Vicki knows. I wish you well and hope things get better for you soon. And it always does a heart good to be able to talk about such losses to friends here on the forum. take care.

Bernice

-- Bernice (geminigoats@yahoo.com), May 02, 2001.

David,

I'm so sorry you lost her. Have your friend teach you how to "let the gas out". Use a hypodermic syringe, large gauge, and it is inserted on the Left side, into the bloat. This allows the gas to escape and relieves the pressure on the heart. Had to do this to a couple sheep once...they'd gotten into the grain. Don't shove a house down their throat..you'd probably kill them. Different remedies for different species. Also, get the vaccinated for Endotoxemia..."overeater's disease". I'm not sure if baking soda in water would have helped...might have helped relieve the gas. Good luck with the rest.

-- (bearwaoman@Yahoo.com), May 02, 2001.

I am having a little bloating going with my sheep on heavy pasture. I am not letting them out all day today to help. I lost my dog last year to bloat. We are still in shock over that one. I know how you feel, sorry for your lost. By the way I feed sheep replacer to one of my bottle babies but only give enough, it her side bloats out I would lower the amount.

-- Debbie (bwolcott@cwis.net), May 02, 2001.

A good effective fast treatment for bloat is listed in an old post cattle (health/treatment)it's the 33 post in that section. Ken gives a remedy from a book ,that vegetable oil will stop the foaming of gas in the animals stomach.It worked for my goat.I thought I was going to lose my best milker to bloat about 2 weeks ago,she was so big I thought she was going to explode.I looked in my goat book and looked through the old post and found that a cup of regular vegtable oil poured down the goats mouth while someone strong held it open was a very fast way to stop bloat.She was able to walk in a few hours.She couldn't even stand before I gave it to her.Thanks to Ken and my book she good as new.

-- SM Steve (A12goat@cs.com), May 02, 2001.

You may want to use some percautions when using milk replacer, especially if it is not formulated for kids and lambs. Keep Bloat Guard or Thera Bloat on hand and pour a small amount into each of the bottles. Try your hardest to not buy milk replacer with soy in it. The only time in which we want to be using all animal products! Make sure and follow the directions to the letter, feeding the milk at their body temperature. Did you know on Purina's kid milk replacer they want you feeding 1 or 2 bottles only, and only 1/2 pint each feeding? This is only 1 cup, at each feeding! Considerably less than even the poorest milker gives, and certainly less than the 3, 20 ounce bottles of goat milk we offer, just goes to show you how inferior of a product milk replacers are. You also need to think about vaccinating with a CD&T, entertoxemia, though miss thought of as an "overeaters" is a toxin which grows rapidly in a acid rumen. Adding a pinch of baking soda to your milk replacer bottles also keeps the acid down in the rumen. Jeffers Livestock catalog also carries a product called Whole Milk Fortefier, it has products in it like probios, course you could also use Probios dispersable powder in each bottle. You will also want to introduce a very palatable grain mix and good legume hay for the kids, very early, they certainly won't be getting near the calories or calcium they need to grow to their potential on that little amount of fake milk!

I am so sorry for your loss, and especially bothering is how robust and healthy the majority of LaMancha's are, I certainly wouldn't be using that brand of replacer! Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh TX (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), May 02, 2001.

I'm so sorry for your loss. Sometimes these things happen. I have not had the best results with replacer, and have had kids die rather suddenly, too. Now I try to feed plain goat's milk if at all possible. The other thing I've learned is that goats are usually strong and healthy, but when they go down or get sick, they really can go fast, within hours. Sometimes it has not even been possible to get help for the kid before it is already dead, so time is of the essensce.

-- Chamoisee (chamoisee@yahoo.com), May 02, 2001.

I am so sad for you!!! (((((HUGS)))))

-- Cindy in Ok (cynthiacluck@yahoo.com), May 03, 2001.

I bought my milk goats from Vicki.One was a buckling still on the bottle.Vicki started him on whole vitamin D milk before he was shipped.He arrived healthy with very soft,glossy hair.I kept him on grocery store milk until he was weaned.Today I have a buckling with bloom in his coat.Vicki sure knows how to care for her goats. Bettie

-- Bettie Ferguson (jobett@dixie-net.com), May 04, 2001.

Well, now I am curious, is the whole Vitamin D milk regular cow milk from the store? I have some lambs on goats milk when I can get it. Inbetween I use Land 'O Lakes lamb milk replacer. Now with this discussion on bloating with milk replacer mixes, could I safely use cow milk? I can get the goat milk for $3.00 gallon pasteurized and the milk replacer is now up to $43.00 a 25lb bag.

-- Kate henderson (kate@sheepyvalley.com), May 04, 2001.

Yes Kate, we have done that for years. When customers like Bettie purchase bottle kids, I slowly wean them from goats milk (the does she purchased were bred but the buck would have been weaned before they were due to kid) to Whole Vitamin D grocery store milk. We have never had any problems with this, no bloating and as long as you feed it warm no scours. I have even used it to top off bottles or the lambar using it cold turkey switching before with no problems. I used to supplement the bottles with Red cell, but now that we know it contains beef liver we don't use this anymore. Goat Nutridrench would be a great vitamin booster for both this and pasturised goat milk. Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh TX (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), May 05, 2001.