I just recieved one of the new Leica 21-24-28 vari-finders, product #12014. The first thing I did was rip open the box to check it out, find a very nice little mini Leica lens case, zip it open and pull out the new dream finder. First impression is, "WOW! This thing is soooo much better than my fixed 24 finder - nicely built, clear, bright optics with no distortion, positive detents on the FL selector, rubber bumper at the objective so glasses don't get scratched, and a very high-quality feel to it, plus the unit is slightly offset to place it more directly inline with the lens - nice touch." But, as I look through it, I notice it views at full frame with no frameline so it does not offer the capability to see outside of the frame - curious...

Then, as I was putting it back in the box, I noticed the label on the box says "Made in Japan"! "Has to mean the box or the label," I think. So, I pull the finder out of the box and out of its very neat mini Leica lens case again and checked it out. "Good," I think, as I see "LEICA CAMERA GERMANY" is nicely engraved right on the objective... Then I look at the bottom of the foot, and right there stamped in plain english is "MADE IN JAPAN" followed by the product number "12014".

Wasn't there a discussion here a few months back about Cosina and Leica having some un-official partnership? Looks like the rumor could be true...

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), June 11, 2001

Answers

Jack: is the foot made of plastic or metal?

-- Jay (infinitydt@aol.com), June 11, 2001.

Jay:

The foot and body are both made of metal, which I would bet is anodized aluminum.

Also, I realize that some may infer from the above post that I think this new finder is somehow "inferior" because it is constructed in Japan... I would venture to declare the opposite and say it is significantly better consructed than Leica's fixed finder for my 24! To wit, my 24 finder reminds of the little keychain-picture-viewing- thing-a-ma-bobs we used to get as prizes in Cracker Jacks boxes as kids, while this new finder screams quality reminiscent of older Leitz brightline finders.

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), June 11, 2001.

Jack,

How much bigger is the new finder compared to a standard single focal length finder?

-- Bob (robljones@home.com), June 11, 2001.

Can you tell us what the new finder costs. I look forward to something other than the current finder on the 24mm-m. I really dislike the current one.

T. Gallagher

-- T. Gallagher (tgallagher10@yahoo.com), June 11, 2001.

Bob:

The new finder is bigger -- I don't have it front of me now to measure, but I'd say it's about 25mm in diameter overall and it sits about 8mm off the camera, but is now directly centered over the lens.

T:

It cost me $350.00, and I bought it from Dr. Klaus Lang in Germany. He has one listed on eBay now if you want to look at it, but you can contact him directly at: drlang@t-online.de - He is a VERY honorable gentleman to deal with, and has almost anything "Leica" you could want.

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), June 11, 2001.

Am I alone in liking the plastic viewfinders? I had the metal ones and found them to be more prone to damage both cosmetic and optical in any fall or impact. I use my cameras and would rather that the finder broke off than bend my top plate! My metal finder was always looking for inapproriate places to slip off while I was photographing with the other body. The plastic finders have yet to fall off once. The optics are clearer and brighter in the plastic finders and the foot is offset so that it is almost centered over the lens. I like them! Please send me your unloved finders and I will make sure they are well looked after and receive regular cuddling.

Cheers,

-- John Collier (jbcollier@powersurfr.com), June 11, 2001.

One other "plus" I forgot to mention -- For those of you who use them, this finder accepts the screw-in eyepiece correction diopters for the M6.

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), June 11, 2001.

Thanks Jack for the info; I've just order one from my local dealer-- it's perfect for my 21mm, 25mm and 28mm lenses! I have read in a local photo magazine that Leica is collaborating with an unnamed Japanese camera maker; I thought it could be Minolta, but now it looks like it could well be Cosina.

-- Hoyin Lee (leehoyin@hutchcity.com), June 12, 2001.

>The optics are clearer and brighter in the plastic finders and the foot is offset so that it is almost centered over the lens.<

John: This new finder makes the Leica plastic one seem like you're looking through the peephole in a disposable camera, and the offset on the new one puts the finder directly over the lens, not just "almost centered". But in your defense, the new one sits a bit higher, and appears so much sturdier that it would possibly rip the hotshoe off the camera if it was struck hard enough.

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), June 12, 2001.

Leitz has had a long "partnership" with Minolta, which has built many "Leica" cameras; so I would suspect Minota, not Cosina.

-- Phil Stiles (Stiles@s-way.com), June 12, 2001.

Well for $350.00 I would suspect of eeeveryone!!

-- r watson (al1231234@hotmail.com), June 12, 2001.

In my opinion, the new Leica VIEWFINDER for 21/24/28 mm look much more like the viewfinder Contax is selling for its Biogon T* 21mm f2.8.

By the way, Kyocera is making zooms for Leica.

-- Lucien (lucien_vd@yahoo.fr), June 12, 2001.

Okay. Sounds like Kyocera is the likely candidate. I understand they make all of the Contax equipment now, so it is a reasonable assumption.

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), June 12, 2001.

Almost forgot to ask: Are Hologons, Biogons, Distagons, Sonnars, Tessars and Planars all made by Kyocera now?

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), June 12, 2001.

> all made by Kyocera now?

I believe all Contax MM and later Contax lenses are manufacturered in Japan. I don't know the exact details, just a couple of tidbits that Blake Ziegler of Contax mentioned a few years ago.

Also, he stated that the Japanese lenses were actually (and tested) better than the late German-made counterparts simply because the tooling was lots newer.

-- John Hicks (jbh@magicnet.net), June 13, 2001.

I know that the H ologon 16mm f8 and the Te le Apotessar 300mm f2.8 are made in Germany.

-- Lucien (lucien_vd@yahoo.fr), June 13, 2001.

Lucien:

I'm not trying to be confrontational, just very curious... If what you say is true, how come the links you provided are copywrited by Kyocera?

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), June 13, 2001.

Okay, here the links copywrited by ZEISS : - Hologon - Tele-Apotessar

By the way Zeiss lenses are also used by Alpa, Arri, Leica, Hasselblad, Rollei, Sony and Yashica.

Lucien

-- lucien (lucien_vd@yahoo.fr), June 13, 2001.

Lucien:

Again, not to be confrontational, but the links you provided do not have a Zeiss copyright. The pdf files associated with them do have the Zeiss logo, but no "copyright". I'm not saying they aren't made by Zeiss, but I find it curious that nowhere do any of the pages you have linked to, or any others that I could find, say that Zeiss optics are "made in Germany". Curious, don't you think? Do newer Zeiss lenses actually say "made in Germany" on them?

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), June 13, 2001.

I'm a reformed Zeiss user....a few of the 35mm Zeiss/Contax lenses are still German-made - the G-Hologon, the 300 2.8 as already mentioned, also 16mm fisheye, 15 for SLR's (just discontinued) They are marked "Made in Germany" or "Made in West Germany". The ones made in Japan are marked "Made in Japan".

I don't think you can be too cagey with these kinds of labels - international trade law pretty much requires that they be accurate. Even VW's have to have "Made in Mexico" labels on 'em.

-- Andy Piper (apidens@denver.infi.net), June 14, 2001.

Actually I can't swear the 15mm Distagon is discontinued for Contax - but they did quit making the "Leica" version.

Query - how are the "minolta" Leica SLR lenses marked. 16, 24, 70-210, etc. "Japan" or "Germany"?

-- Andy Piper (apidens@denver.infi.net), June 14, 2001.

The 24 mm is Made in Germany (and engraved accordingly) but is based on a Minolta design.

Lucien

-- lucien (lucien_vd@yahoo.fr), June 14, 2001.

Re the Contax/Zeiss lenses, by and large they're made by Kyocera in Japan on a funky automated production line (under Zeiss QA). But a few of the "made to order" specials like the 300/2.8, 55/1.2 ULD or my 35/2.8 perspective correction lens are (~hand) made by Zeiss in Germany.

Rather tragically, people continue to pay a premium for old used German lenses on eBay when the Japanese lenses are not only better made but have the benefit of continuous design improvements over the years (especially the coatings).

The Zeiss lenses for the Contax 645 are also made in Japan, while the Hassie/Rollei lenses are made at the old Zeiss factory in Germany. The, um, "informed wisdom" has it the Japanese lenses are better -- it's a better factory. But too many Hassie owners won't touch lenses made in Japan so Zeiss can't move production to Japan as they'd like. Yet.

This is currently a very live issue on the Contax SLR mailing list. :- )

-- Joel (Contax SLR slinger, thinking about a Bessa-T/Noctilux for available light, saw the word "finder" and wandered in to discover....)

-- Joel Benford (joel@joel-benford.co.uk), June 25, 2001.