Can someone please expand on the proper fixing for ilford papers? What is the 1min fix - 5min wash - 10min prewash - 5min wash is this after normal 5 min fix? Confused!

-- victor fernandez (vic@megalink.net), September 24, 2001

Answers

Go to Ilford's website. They give full details of their recommended processes.

-- r (ricardospanks1@yahoo.com), September 25, 2001.

Victor, the Ilford archival paper sequence uses a fixing time of one minute. According to Ilford and my own testing, this results in lower residual thiosulfates in the paper. The old "five minute fix" is not necessary. My sequence is: Dev 2-3 minutes, Stop 15 seconds, Fix 1 minute, wash 5 minutes in print washer, 10 minutes in tray with Ilford Washaid (I agitate the prints by shuffling top to bottom), then 5 more minutes in the print washer. Works for me, Ranger Bob

-- Bob Smith (rangerbob1993@yahoo.com), September 25, 2001.

Thank you for the response... After reading the available data this seems to make sense. One more question; Is this process valid only with ilford products or can other rapid fixer/nonhardner be used? How about other papers RC kodak etc. ?

thanx again for the help Vic

-- victor fernandez (vic@megalink.net), September 25, 2001.

Victor, I use all Ilford products because they match my style. You would have to do residual thiosulfate tests with other papers/chemicals. Bob

-- Bob Smith (rangerbob1993@yahoo.com), September 25, 2001.

Be sure to use the fixer at film strength rather than paper strength. I have used Kodak Rapid Fixer (Ilford technical info says to use a rapid fixer and does not limit it to their product), and this seems to work fine.

-- Jim Rock (jameswrock@aol.com), September 25, 2001.

Check out following discussions about the Ilford toning on Google Groups:

http://groups.google.com/g roups?sourceid=navclient&q=knoppow+ilford+fixing

-- Anders Blomqvist (FIN) (anders.blomqvist@bigfoot.com), September 27, 2001.

The ILFORD Archival Processing Sequence uses rapid (ammonium thiosulphate) fixer at a stronger mix than other manufacturers generally recommend. For ILFORD fixers, the correct dilution is 1+4. With Kodak fixers (and probably most others), this is referred to as 'film strength'. Fixer should be used without hardener, as hardener both slows down the fixing action and makes washing more difficult.

By using the fixer at the higher concentration, the fix can remove the silver compounds very rapidly, allowing the shorter fixing times. With the shorter times, the fixer compounds do not have time to bind to the fibers in the paper, therefore making them easier to wash out.

Note that, while ILFORD has run extensive testing of this process, all tests were conducted with ILFORD products. While competitive products may also be suitable for this application, ILFORD makes no claims on either the suitablity or lack thereof.

The full Archival Processing Sequence is:

Normal development Stop - 15-30 seconds. Fix - 1 minute Wash - 5 minutes Wash Aid - 10 minutes Final Wash - 5 minutes

For RC papers, the fixing time can be reduced to 30 seconds. Since RC papers cannot absorb chemicals through the polythene layers, wash aid is not needed, and a wash time as short at 2 minutes in running water will give sufficient washing.

For best permanence, all prints, either fiber or RC, should be toned with a product such as Kodak Rapid Selenium Toner. If you wish to tone during the processing sequence, you can mix the toner with diluted wash aid. This bath is then used immediatly after the fix bath, with no intermediate wash. Prints should then be transferred to a fresh bath of wash aid for 10 minutes, followed by a 30 minute wash. For RC prints, wash time need only be about 5 minutes.

David Carper ILFORD Technical Service

-- David Carper (david.carper@ilford.com), September 28, 2001.

Papers other than Ilford may not be fully fixed in the short time and 'film strength' fixer. Kodak still recommends against using this sequence with their papers. Other makers are quietly recommending more traditional methods as well. Many experienced printers who are also darkroom chemistry guru's say stay away from the short fix times. One problem often stated is the quick reduction in action of the fresh fix once two or more prints have run through it. I don't know of any reliable tests on just how quickly freshly mixed fix loses its capacity with each 8x10 unit equivalent processed in it. I can only state what has been told me by those more versed in the chemistry. Their advice is, to a man(an woman), use a more traditional two bath fixing method.

-- Dan Smith (shooter@brigham.net), September 29, 2001.

Thank you for all the good information. I guess the best way is to test the print. I will try to find a thread that mentions a test to assure proper fix. Thanx again Victor

-- Victor (victor@culturediversity.org), October 13, 2001.