Before I try to finish ldrun3, I would like to clarify a point ... Ldrun has 24 different levels, ldrun2-3-4 has 30 different levels ; after that, game loops to level 1

Do players prefer : (a) to stop playing after last level and try to find the best way to maximize bonus on each level so to get the highest score on a limited number of levels (24 or 30) (b) to play till game is over

On ldrun2-3 (ldrun4 hasn't been finished yet), all players suicide after level 30, which tends to show they prefer (a) ; I also prefer (a) : (b) spoil the game, (a) is cool because it implies interesting studies to optimize points , and believe me it makes the game much more pleasant to play

I would like to know if everybody is ok for (a) ; if there are no objections, I will edit the "special rules"

It will also require help from an editor to rescore and break all those "999999" ties on ldrun & ldruna

Waiting for your advices ...

-- Phil (plamat@club-internet.fr), December 02, 2001

Answers

I think a. is a good answer.If you compete the game you will already have lots of points. Also playing back a loderunner inp that has been finish you can learn a lot. Looking at KLOV there is now loderunner 5 the dig fight. Released only in Japan,two player, new levels. Don't know if copied to mame or not.

-- Phil Younger (robot5001@aol.com), December 02, 2001.

If you want to a... I want to stop the continuous stomping of enemy leech. (the leech where if you keep stomping an enemy for 1,000 points / pop (500 for ldrun4 at least)... that can be big time points if it was said and done...

-- Gameboy9 (goldengameboy@yahoo.com), December 02, 2001.

a. is the obvious answer as long as when the levels are repeated, they are repeated at the same difficulty and they continue to repeat in the same way not hide other possibly different levels after the second loop...

I'll help edit the scores if we can rely on the 24 and 30 repeating levels, (do you think there are 30 repeating levels on ldrun4 or are we unsure until someone finishes it.)

-- Chad (churritz@crash.cts.com), December 02, 2001.

Yes Chad : I'm sure of the 30 levels of ldrun4 (you can choose level 31 with Pugsy cheat file and it will give you level 1)

-- phil (plamat@club-internet.fr), December 02, 2001.

I'd say (c) - take highest score of a completed loop of 24/30 levels in a recording, play until game is over.

Are there any noticeable difficulty differences between, say, 1 and 25 in ldrun, or 1 and 31 in the other three?

-- dissolute city (mdenham@coinet.com), December 04, 2001.

I didn't see any difference between levels n and n+30 ... Gameboy pointed out a very interesting point : the "continuous stomping of enemy leech" as he said ; I don't know how to avoid that ... shall we ban ? Darn the guy who had the idea of rewarding a stomping by 1000 pts !

Did anybody manage to playback ldrun3 first place ?? Score is 1.8 million but I'm afraid there is a big part of leeching ; unhappily I don't manage to play it back because version used is "mac"

-- phil (plamat@club-internet.fr), December 05, 2001.

I've tried lots of different things to get it to play back. Even including editing the .inp. The best I can do is get it to play back round 1 and having it lose synch somewhere during round 2. But even from that, I can tell the story already. During round 1, he jumps off a ladder on top of an enemy LOTS of times. His score after round 1 is around 100k. I finished Lode Runner 3, but refused to do that. The only place I really did it was round 23 or 25 (?) where you can trap the hidden enemy and get a lot of points very quickly.

I had two options when I played it: No leeching, but maximising otherwise or leech like crazy. And if I chose the former, I could choose to stop after 30 or play on until I beat the #1 score. I decided to stop after 30. Once you can finish all 30, it just becomes a contest of who wants to play it the longest. Well, I don't want to spend 12 hours or so, playing the same 30 round 7 times or so to max it out (assuming it maxes out at 9,999,999, which I think it does).

Sometimes, you accidentally walk too soon and jump on top of an enemy. If there are going to be anti-leeching rules, then those need to be very clear. There are several ways of scoring extra points (maximising/leeching) in Lode Runner. For those interested, look at what I do at the end of round 13, for instance. Is that leeching? Or look at what lots of people (me included) do at round 6, freeing the 4 enemies, then trapping them again, several times. Is that leeching?

Again, if there are going to be rules, then they need to be very clear. While Lode Runner has a time limit, so people can't spend forever leeching, I think watching someone jump off a ladder on top of an enemy every single round for one or two minutes is extremely boring to watch, and, maybe more importantly, does not require or show any skill whatsoever.

I don't know where you'd draw the line exactly, and it may have to be redrawn a few times, because, like I said, there are several ways of scoring a lot of points. But what I saw in the #1 recording, the little of it I could get to play back and what I saw in the #2 recording (now #3), I wasn't too crazy about. I did a lot less leeching than the ex-#2 recording and still scored higher. But even my recording might be considered leeching at certain points.

Well, I'd be happy to see some solid rules and I wouldn't mind if I had to play it again because my recording was considered illegal under those rules either.

Cheers, Ben Jos.

-- Ben Jos Walbeehm (walbeehm@walbeehm.com), December 07, 2001.

As far as the jumping-onto-enemies thing is concerned... First time is okay, second time is questionable, third time is leeching.

-- dissolute city (mdenham@coinet.com), December 08, 2001.

All that Ben Jos says is correct ; leeching is very hard to determinate in this game ; and Matt, sometimes it is necessary to stomp several times on enemies head because it makes them loosen the yellow thing they still carry and you have to pick without entrapping them to get 20000 pts bonus

During all the week I've played the game (I finally managed to finish all 30 originals levels :))), I changed my mind ; as Ben Jos, I refused to do the stomping leeching (even on round 23, which penalized me about 50000pts)

So I think the best way to fight this sort of leeching is try get the higher level you can ; I've finished level 30 with 1 life left, Ben Jos and Ryan finished it with 0 life left : even if you know the game , it's not so easy to made a "30 levels loop" without dying ; and IMO doing 9999999 (7 or 8 loops) would also be an exploit

So I think now it's better to keep scoring as it is (b) to avoid leeching effects. Or maybe we could think about another type of scoring which counts score after 30 levels AND number of life left (score after level 30 + 1000000xlifes left for example)

-- phil (plamat@club-internet.fr), December 08, 2001.