I may be the only person who did not know this but the immunizations required by the state of Arkansas for attendance in public school are way different than those recommened by the Health dept. I have been worrying about whether or not to vaccinate my daughter. We have a whooping cough outbreak here and I am concerned about it. I called my local health dept. to ask why so many cases are appearing. She said that a lot of people don't give the vaccine because the children had a reaction to it. The truth is that you don't even have to have it here. Arkansas requires the following vaccinations for public or private school: Polio-3 DTaP or DT-3 (Diptheria, Tetanus, acellular Pertussis or whooping cough) Measles-2 Rubella-1 Mumps-1 Hepatitis B-3 Chicken Pox-1 Anyone who is from around here can see this in a much shorter list than the health dept. leads you to believe. The Hib vaccine is not even required. So you can make your own decision about whether to or how much to vaccinate your child. I strongly encourage everyone to check their state law. I still haven't decided what I am going to do.

-- renabeth (renabeth@yahoo.com), December 05, 2001

Answers

As a parent who did lots of research on this, get it done. It is not worth the risk if you child gets one of these and passes it to other children that may be weak. If your child dies form one of these diseases then you will wish you did.

-- phillip (raines@rainesridgefarm.com), December 05, 2001.

If it helps make your decision any easier, please remember just why these vaccines were developed in the first place, millions of healthy children and weakened adults died from polio, diptheria, measles, and whooping cough every year! Polio and diptheria are especialy bad, diptheria you literally drown in your own phlegm in the matter of a few days. Pertussis, you watch your child's fever climb higher, and higher, until the brain is fried like an egg, all in the course of a few hours time.

These were, and still are, horrific diseases that are equally contagious to the healthy as well as the weak, every Mother's nightmare.

Take advantage of the vaccines, the alternative is not pleasant or pretty, and the victim suffers horribly before they die.

Yes, all vaccines have their inherent risks, but so does going to the dentist, but does that mean you should never go to the dentist and have a tooth filled? The risks are infinitesimal compared to the benefits.

-- Annie Miller in SE OH (annie@1st.net), December 05, 2001.

Hi Renabeth,

I will check into this to clarify what shots are required. I am the educational program administrator for a early childhood special education program in Boone county. I don't know the exact shots off the top of my head as we recently moved here. I have heard of the whooping cough epedimic here from the radio. it shocked me to hear of the number of cases. I am aware of some parents, well, back in NC, that don't like to vaccinate because many believed that autism was caused by reaction to vaccinations. It seemed that in the county i worked in there were many kids the same age who had autism. But then there are so many theories around its hard to say.

I'll verify and then get back to you.

-- Bernice (geminigoats@yahoo.com), December 05, 2001.

I agree with the poster that said do it. If your child dies from one of the preventable you will never recover. There is some danger any time you do anything but here the odds are really on your side with the vaccines and against you if you don't get them. If you want to know how devastating child hood disease was around the early part of the 1900's and before just go to any large cemetary and read the tome stones. There are sometimes five or six children laid side by side. Almost every family lost several children in infancy we do not want to go back to that. In some ways the good old days were not so good.

-- David (bluewaterfarm@mindspring.com), December 05, 2001.

I agree that it is a hard decision, I home school and have the option not to vaccinate, so I have been able to pick and chose, While my children have gotten sick when around other children (flu) while I have never had it, (I had hard measles, whooping cough, chicken pox, mumps, all as a child), So, I have vaccinated for most of the stuff that is available, but in many cases I waited until my child was older than 1st is recomended and watched their diets before and after to suport their immune system, and I watched them like a hawk!

I listened to my gut instincts as to what shots when, keeping a journal of the hours and days after the shots, both of mine had reactions in the mild to moderate range,(high fever, swelling, redness) The youngest stopped breathing in his sleep for a few seconds several hours after one set of shots but I was setting up holding him because I knew it was possible he would have a reaction, I got him started again and we had no more problems with it, So I am very glad I didn't just go along with our 1st Dr. and do the shots at a younger age.

One shot clinic refused to do the younger child, after reading his reaction to the prevouse set, and we soon changed Dr. and this one said that fewer shots were better, so all the others were spread out so as to reduce the stress on his system. Shoot, this doctor flat said that if the kid wasn't around other children they didn't need the shots until they "were" going to be in groups.

Trust your gut, so you will know you made the best decision you could.....(I think parental instinct is very under-rated)

-- Thumper (slrldr@yahoo.com), December 05, 2001.

A couple of other things to consider before vaccinating.

Many doctors oppose certain immunizations because the risks outweigh the benefits. www.aapsonline.org (left column )Doctor group votes to oppose vaccine mandates.

Many people, including myself until the other day, did not know that many vaccinations come from aborted fetus tissue. That made me sick to read. However there are alternatives, but you have to do your homework. www.cogforlife.org/fetalvaccines.htm

There is also the issue of mercury in vaccinations possibly causing autism.

It is up to you as parents and grandparents to stay abreast of what is happening in the field. Because no one will look out for your children better than you, no matter how many degrees they have after their name. What many of them have in learned information, they have lost in common sense. Use your God-given abilities to do what is right for your family, not what the government says.

Talk to you later.

-- Bob in WI (bjwick@hotmail.com), December 05, 2001.

Bernice~

I will be interested to see what you find out. We attend Bentonville school district in Benton County, close to you. My boys were all required to have the HiB vaccines. My 13 year old just had his last HepB or he would not have been allowed in the school building the next day. I wonder if some of the districts take it upon themselves to require more shots than others. I think tuberculosis vaccine is very important because so many of the immigrants we have been seeing come in to our area carry this disease, whether they are affected by it or not. I do find it odd that you have to have a TB test and pass to work in a public school, but not to work in a food processing facility!!

-- Ivy in NW AR (balch84@cox-internet.com), December 06, 2001.

As a polio survivor, I will tell you to please get the vaccination! I hear that parents are not having their childen get the polio vaccination and there may be another outbreak of it! Good Lord! When you realize how insidious this illness is, the whole thought is frightening! Fifty-five years later, I am still dealing with the consequences.

-- Ardie /WI (ardie54965@hotmail.com), December 06, 2001.

I grew up before many of these vaccinations were available. I remember floating in fevers of I don't know what infection (measels, mumps, chicken pox, etc.) with my mother hovering over me in deep concern, of trying to cough my lungs onto the floor with whooping cough. It is not a fond memory. If I had been offered death, I would have taken it. Then, 50 years ago, it was normal. Now it is not. Then, not all the kids lived through it. Now, all can survive. Yes, there are risks, discomforts and genuine pain associated with vaccinations. That is true of all actions in life. From my point of view, not to vaccinate yourselve or your kids is degrading to humanity. Not only do you expose you and yourn to risk, you expose society to risk. Disease exists. It always has. Vaccination works. Be sane.

-- Martin Boraas (boraas@miliserv.net), December 06, 2001.

As a parent who does NOT vaccinate, work in group homes and see the consequences of vaccination in some of the clients I worked with. Retardation, autism, seizure disorders. Talk to my friend who can't drive due to the seizure disorder she developed after vaccination. Talk to my friend whose son developed mental retardation and a seizure disorder after vaccinations.

Study HOW vaccinations are cultured, and how they are injected, and how this effects your immunity system. Study how pharmaceutical companies and statistics lie. Learn the links and payoffs between the pharmaceutical companies and medical schools/doctors. Learn how polio was already on the decline UNTIL they began vaccinations. My own birth family has horribly damaged systems I firmly believe was due to vaccinations ... rheumatoid arthristis, asthma, allergies, alopecia, etc., etc. (all of which can be linked to vaccinations), which influenced why we chose NOT to vaccinate.

Reactions to many of these illnesses also directly corresponds to the diet and nutrition of people. Polio became damaging at a time when refined flour (white) and refined sugars and processed foods became big. In one county they recommended everyone only eat WHOLE GRAINS, no processed sugar and no refined foods. Guess what? That county had the lowest rate of polio increase of the nation.

My own children had whooping cough, and it wasn't that big of a deal....I lost sleep, but thankfully they never suffered through the pertussis vaccine, which is one of the deadliest (the one that permanently damaged my friend's son and other children I have worked with).

There is the National Vaccine center you could check with. If you want I can give you a list of alternative books to balance your decision out. Also, different laws are written in different ways. For example, in Illinois and in Wisconsin you CANNOT enter school without vaccines. What they don't tell you is you CAN if you sign a waiver for not doing it for personal or religious reasons (in IL by law a personal philosophical view is considered a religious view). Look into this.

You can consider suing them force them to sign a waiver, saying they accept full responsibility for lifelong care for you child should your child develop any of the conditions most commonly associated with vaccinations, including learning disabilities, asthmas, allergies, etc., etc., within the year of the vaccinations. This has been successful at times in the past.

I am adamently opposed to vaccinations because they are dangerous, toxic and the long term consequences of having monkey DNA and RNA injected into our major organs (by directing into the blood cells instead of taking them orally) has not been adequately tested. They say they are safe except for certain occaisions (I can NEVER spell that word right), but note the increase in learning disabilities including ADD and ADHD, autism, allergies, asthma, etc., etc. The companies which study the safety of vaccinations seem to always have a financial interest in having them used for one reason or another.

-- marcee (thathope@mwt.net), December 06, 2001.

Thank you, Marcee, for interjecting another point of perspective. Why vaccinate against chicken pox? -- it is a minor illness in childhood, only serious if someone gets it in their teens or adulthood. Same with measles & mumps. Some of the higher mortality rates for infectious diseases in the olden days was also due to poor nutrition, lack of heating & sanitation, ignorance of proper care, etc. I think they give too many vaccinations too close together/or at the same time at too early an age. And then the medical authorities & pharmaceutical companies do not want to look at the correlation between between vaccinations and side effects/bad reactions/subsequent health troubles.

-- snoozy (bunny@northsound.net), December 06, 2001.

I didn't know you could say no to vaccinations so my children got theirs. My youngest daughter had 105 fever with her second set of DPT. The health dept. knew immediatly that it was the Pertussis. I was still a trusting mother wanting my children to be healthy. They both had all of their shots for school. My oldest was in 7th and my youngest was in 2nd when we started homeschooling. They have not had ANY vaccinations since. I have been enlightened my many homeschoolers about the dangers. I would still do polio but that is about it. My oldest brother had polio so I know how bad it can be. But when more children die of or have severe reactions to the vaccine than to the disease something is seriously wrong. My youngest is now 11 and she still runs a fever of 103-105 for no reason on a regular basis ( at least once every couple months). Good luck on your decision but check everything carefully before you decide what to do. Don't go into with blind faith that these peolpe will take care of your children.

-- Lou Ann in KY (homes_cool@msn.com), December 06, 2001.

Do what you all want, but those who do not at least vaccinate against diptheria and tetanus have NEVER seen someone die from it, or you would think differently, and it killed normal healthy children and adults the same as "sickly' ones!!! Nutrition and poor care had NOTHING to do with the spread of those bacterial diseases.

These diseases used to kill one fifth to one quarter of ALL live births before the advent of vaccines, and still you want to return to those times??? That reasoning is beyond my ability to comprehend.

-- Annie Miller in SE OH (annie@1st.net), December 06, 2001.

Both my children got the requirements for immunizations. Before my daughter entered kindergarten last year she had to get them all over again throughout this past year. The doctors office where she got them originally lost her records when they moved to another location. I've learned to keep copies for myself now. I felt bad and was unsure if I made the right decision by putting her through it again. If the opt-out process was easier I would have done that. I didn't want to be interrogated over why I didn't want my daughter to get another round of shots over the course of the last year. They wouldn't accept my word that she'd had them already, they needed a paper to prove it. I did however turn down the hepatitis vaccine the doctors office insisted she needed. They said it'll be mandatory here soon.

-- Dave (something@somewhere.com), December 06, 2001.

I have to disagree with the person who said chicken pox is not dangerous in children. My cousin's 5 year old son got a chicken pox on his brain!! They can form on the inside of your body. He was in the hospital for a week with swelling in the brain and very high fevers. Fortunately, he has not had any side effects, but the doctor said if she had not got him to the doctor as soon as she did, it could have been fatal!!

-- Ivy in NW AR (balch84@cox-internet.com), December 06, 2001.

I appreciate everyones opinions on the subject, but really the whole point was to just let you know that all the shots your local health department gives may or may not be required to attend school. Our health dept. misleads parent into thinking that they need approx. 7 more shot than are required by the state. I feel that everyone should be told outright exactly what is required. I called them about the whooping cough vaccine to ask why so many kids are getting the disease. They said that they did not finish their DTP shot. The truth is that the P which is Pertussis(whooping cough) is not even required here. I understand fully that some children die when they get these diseases, but a lot of them do not. I mean a lot of people die from the flu every year, but I don't take a flu shot and I am not afraid of it. I have had whooping cough myself and while the younger a child is the more dangerous it becomes. Most children do not die from it. Rubella and mumps are harmless in childhood, but are serious in adults. Chicken pox can be serious, but most of the time it is not. Hepatitis B is manly an STD, but can be contracted in other ways. Polio, Diptheria and Tetanus are serious. But most people only contract tetanus after a deep wound. I do not know anyone who have had these above diseases, but I know lots of people who have had measles, mumps and rubella, and they are fine Hib is some type of bacterial menigitis, but I believe most people exposed to it, it is not that serious. That is what I have learned about these diseases. I think the best you can do is educate yourself on the risks and benefits and make the best decision possible for you and your family.But the main point of this post is to let you know that the health dept. is not always forth coming about state law. Thanks.

-- renabeth (renabeth@yahoo.com), December 07, 2001.

Renabeth, you are very wrong about tetanus, it is present in all soil everywhere, and anyone can develop tetanus from any open wound exposed to the tinyest amounts of soil.

Doctors recommend tetanus be given every ten years for everyone who lives in a rural environment or who has animals they care for daily, especially large animals. My doctor lectured me for a half hour after I had let my tetanus booster expire.

-- Annie Miller in SE OH (annie@1st.net), December 08, 2001.

I vaccinate my goats for tetanus, why ever would I not vaccinate my children??

Chicken Pox not dangerous?? I guess you have never experienced the high fevers associated with a severe case. My thoughts are that it is too bad that the young people who are claiming that they are protecting their children by not vaccinating them should somehow be beamed back in time and have to sit by their very sick child's bed for days on end. I thank God every day that my children don't have to go through what I did with their children!!!

Where ever did all this paranoia about the health department come into play??? Like why the heck would they, as overworked as they are, give a rip to have you get more injections than you need??

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), December 08, 2001.

Diane, please re-read my posting. I did acknowledge that in some cases chickenpox can be serious. As far as the health dept. goes I have nothing against them other than they mislead parents into thinking their children must have more vaccinations than are required to go to school. Annie, I know that tetanus is very serious and is present all around, but MOST of the time it takes a puncture wound to get it. I really don't have a problem with tetanus shots, if you want to take them and give them to your goats, that is fine with me. I was just trying to tell everyone what the State of Arkansas really requires for school attendence. As far as what diseases are serious and which are not, that is strictly my opinion and I am not a doctor. Please speak to your personal physician about what vaccinations are appropriate for you and your family. Thanks.

-- renabeth (renabeth@yahoo.com), December 08, 2001.

Oh and Diane, could the reason the health dept. require more shots have something to do with money? Just a thought, not that any of our goverment agencies would ever consider doing something like that.

-- renabeth (renabeth@yahoo.com), December 08, 2001.

I guess I missed your "point". Sorry, must be tough in Arkansas. In Michigan the shots are given free and the department is small and under-funded.

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), December 08, 2001.