Without in any way intending to demean this impressive benchmark design,and certainly an optic worth saving for,I have noted my asph.35mm 'Lux appears to render color very slightly "warmer" in comparison to other 35 M's I've used: 8 element,3'rd version and Summicron R.I am well aware of color variances in transparency and print films and indeed color print reproduction.Is this perception attributable merely to modern lens coatings,this particular design,my photo taking(I'm not under exposing) or just my imagination?

-- Sheridan Zantis (albada60@hotmail.com), January 04, 2002

Answers

I'm not aware of any dramatic color shift in the new Asph's. One question is whether you're doing a side by side comparison (same film, subject, lighting, etc). If not one can't really say...........

-- Bob Todrick (bobtodrick@yahoo.com), January 04, 2002.

My 35/1.4ASPH renders color, if not exactly, then so close I couldn't see any difference between it and the rest of my M and R lenses, which is to say such that I generally prefer an 81A filter for scenic shots, which puts the color balance alongside Nikkor lenses whose color rendition I prefer. I have never encountered a Leica lens I would describe as "warm enough" let alone "too warm".

-- Jay (infinitydt@aol.com), January 04, 2002.

Hello Bob.Films I generally use now are Ektachrome 100 plus(slides) and Kodak 100 Gold(prints)with similar lighting situations.The images all show proper color saturation but very subtley appear a tiny fraction "warmer",especially with skin tones.

-- Sheridan Zantis (albada60@hotmail.com), January 04, 2002.

My Gawd, are we into TWO versions of this brand new lens already?

-- (bmitch@home.com), January 04, 2002.

The colour reproduction by photographic lenses is a very subjective issue, and depends on personal taste, film used, quality of light, etc, etc. But if one takes current Leica 50mm f2 as being fairly natural and pleasant, Leica lenses designed before 1990's have been by comparison on the cool (greenish) side. On the other hand, the latest Leica 28mm f2.8 is warmer (about 81A) then the 50mm Summicron. I find Nikkor Ai-S lenses to be very constant in colour (warmer, towards pink, specially when there is too much UV), except for 55mm f2.8 Micro which exibits more of a straw warmth. It is definitely not your imagination.

-- sait (akkirman@clear.net.nz), January 04, 2002.

To bmitch

Yes. Any Leicaphile knows there are two versions of the 35/1.4 Aspherical lens: Version 1 (Cat #11873), with two hand ground and polished aspherical surfaces(1990-1994); and Version 2 (Cat. # 11874), with a single glass-molded aspherical surface (1994- present). Version 2 was offered because manufacture of version 1 took too long and was too expensive. I think there was only one guy who could make the aspherical surfaces to the required tolerances, and he retired!

As far as the color fidelity issue, Erwin has stated that both the 35/1.4 ASPH and the 35/2.0 ASPH have a slightly warmish color rendering, while the pre-ASPH versions of each lens render colors neutrally. His conclusion: "Well. You can't have all."

-- Eliot (erosen@lij.edu), January 04, 2002.

I believe it is true that the 35 summilux aspheric produces a slightly warmer image than pre-aspheric 35s. This is Irwin Puts comparison article from the Leica Papers where he states this. As Puts remarks you just can't seem to have everything.

http://www.imx.nl/photosite/leica/mseries/testm/m2-35.html

Cheers.

-- Don (wgpinc@yahoo.com), January 04, 2002.

It's definatly warmer...I like that! Bokeh not so nice. I'm still deciding whether I like this lens as much as my 4th version summicron. It's bigger, blocks more viewfinder,renders streetlights weird....hmmmm.

-- Emile de Leon (knightpeople@msn.com), January 04, 2002.

Sait nailed it - I've found ALL the 1990's designs (that I've tried: 35 ASPH 1.4 and 2, 90 f/2.8, 90 APO, 21 ASPH) to be very subtley more magenta than my 1975-85 lenses. But you have to be shooting something very neutral to see it - light gray pavement e.g..

Also, I'm shooting Velvia (a film that goes pink in the highlights at the drop of a lenscap) in Denver (with 5,280 more feet of ultraviolet light.) Both factors will emphasize the difference.

Personally, I don't think of it as "warmer" though. There's too much blue in magenta for me to see it as 'warm'. And in late afternoon sunlight the "greeness' of the older lenses actually translates as "minus-magenta" which makes red light more yellow, and blue sky more cyan - both things I like.

I've noticed a tendency among most film and lens manufacturers towards magenta over the past 15 years or so - I think it has to do with an overemphasis on skin tones as a standard for judging color. Me - I prefer a gray card as a standard. (gripe, gripe).

At least Leica has been pretty consistent within each group of lenses.

-- Andy Piper (apidens@denver.infi.net), January 05, 2002.

Thanks for the informative responses to my question.

-- Sheridan Zantis (albada60@hotmail.com), January 05, 2002.

Andy is right on the button on the color redition. However, my reasoning on this observation is a bit different. I think it has to do with the film used. 15 years ago, Kodakchrome was the industrial standard.Leica would used Kodak as their reference which is a magenta biased film compare to Fuji. But now Fuji dominate a much greater market share. Theat's why our Chromes have this greenish tin with the older Leica glass. Things been change, I bet the newer design uses Velvia for testing too.

-- Chi Cheung (chic@intergate.bc.ca), January 05, 2002.

The Noctilux is warm because the 900403 glass absorbs an excessive amount of blue. Newer Solms lenses use glass with high refractive indices that might also absorb more of the blue spectrum.

I don't like warm lenses. That's the reason I got rid of my Nikon gear after many years and chose a new pre-ASPH over a new ASPH Summicron. However, with the demise of Kodachrome 25, my tastes may require an adjustment:-(

-- Bud (budcook@attglobal.net), January 05, 2002.

Here's an experiment to try one of these cold and dark winter evenings. Place all your Leica (Nikon, etc.) lenses on your 5000 degree Kelvin lightbox. Note the difference in color observed through each lens, compared to the color of the lightbox viewed directly. You're going to see differences among the various lenses. For example, I recently observed:

50mm Tabbed Summicron: Dead neutral, no obvious color change.

50mm DR Summicron: Light but discernable amber-yellow cast.

50mm 1969-79 Cron: Same as the DR model.

50mm Collapsible Cron: Stronger yellow/amber cast.

I imagine some of this could be due to coating differences, some to absorption characteristics of the glasses, and some maybe even to yellowing of the cement between elements, if that happens.

These results suggest that while the differences reported above between Nikon and Leica lenses are no doubt real, nevertheless there is significant variation between Leica lenses as well.

It would be interesting to read the results others can report after trying this experiment.

-- Bob Fleischman (RFXMAIL@prodigy.net), January 05, 2002.