Hi All,

I heard from a friend in London who has just seen the new M7. He said he was very disapointed and would be suprised if many M6 users would want to change over to the M7. He said it has a cloth electronic shutter, highest speed of 1000 sec, a higher flash sync - I think he said 125. He also said it has no real Apeture priority only on two speeds he said. Also price is going to be 20% higher than the M6ttl.

He's very reliable so I'm sure most of this is true - but then it's only a couple of weeks and we'll all know anyway.

Sure doesn't sound very exciting.

Mark

-- Mark griffin (gripper@iprimus.com.au), February 07, 2002

Answers

The plot thickens...

-- Giles Poilu (giles@monpoilu.icom43.net), February 07, 2002.

"sure doesn't sound very exciting" - sounds more believable, though

-- steve (stephenjjones@btopenworld.com), February 07, 2002.

"... no real Apeture priority only on two speeds..."

I don't get this statement... perhaps he's mistaken here.

-- Anon Terry (anonht@yahoo.com), February 07, 2002.

"No real aperture priority, only on two speeds"? This simply cannot function as aperture priority autoexposure needs the entire range of shutter speeds (except B) to function. Mark, I'm afraid your friend might have misinterpreted something.

Worse, I fear Leica has once more invented something highly useful that makes the entire first production batch as reliable as a Microsoft product.

-- Oliver Schrinner (piraya@hispavista.com), February 07, 2002.

If the M7 does indeed exist (and the date isn't the 'offcial' announcement of something like the M6 Titanium), where does the M7 keep its batteries for the electronic shutter? I assume they would need to be bigger than the M6 type? Steve

-- Steve Barnett (barnet@globalnet.co.uk), February 07, 2002.

"He's very reliable"

Ahem !

Not so.

-- Lucien (lucien_vd@yahoo.fr), February 07, 2002.

Why don't we all meet up in Epping Forest next Sunday afternoon and beat each other up over it?

-- rob (rob@robertappleby.com), February 07, 2002.

So does Lucien know something we don't.

Do tell...

-- Mark (gripper@iprimus.com.au), February 07, 2002.

What! Then Leica would have to shoot him!

-- John Collier (jbcollier@powersurfr.com), February 07, 2002.

"Why don't we all meet up in Epping Forest next Sunday afternoon..."

Rob are you close to the forest?

-- Giles Poilu (giles@monpoilu.icom43.net), February 07, 2002.

Only in my mind.

Did you spill my pint?

-- rob (rob@robertappleby.com), February 07, 2002.

Apeture priority only on two speeds he said.

Wow! That's exactly 1 speed more than the aperture priority on my Ms now. So I guess it means that the M7 is 100% better than the M6 TTL in this regard,

;-)

-- John (ouroboros_2001@yahoo.com), February 07, 2002.

Just curious Rob, I'm looking at the trees through my window now...

-- Giles Poilu (giles@monpoilu.icom43.net), February 07, 2002.

Rob,

Are allowed to bring our clubs along, or is it bare knuckle only?

-- sparkie (sparkie@mailcity.com), February 07, 2002.

Opps, That should have read:

Are WE allowed to bring our clubs along...

-- sparkie (sparkie@mailcity.com), February 07, 2002.

Hey Rob.....I just saw Giles looking at your bird.

-- Virgil (leicavirgin@hotmail.com), February 07, 2002.

By "Apeture priority only on two speeds he said." I suspsect our unidentified mole means that the system is capable only of selecting the CLOSEST of the two bordering sutter speeds, and is not stepless AE... For example, if the lens is set at f8 and the meter indicates a shutter speed of 1/190th is needed, the camera will default to the 1/250th posistion because it is closest the actual. The first versions of the Pentax 645 did something similar to this, but at least they were in half-stop increments.

If my above interpretation of his statement is correct, then it renders the M7's AE function essentially useless for my needs. But, this rumor is certainly at least now mre believable, especiall given Leica's past reputation on system updates!

;-),

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), February 07, 2002.

By "Apeture priority only on two speeds he said." I suspsect our unidentified mole means that the system is capable only of selecting the CLOSEST of the two bordering sutter speeds, or 1-stop AE, and is not the normal stepless AE we are all familiar with... For example, if the lens is set at f8 and the meter indicates a shutter speed of 1/190th is needed, the camera will default to the 1/250th posistion because it is the closest available. The first versions of the Pentax 645 did something similar to this, but at least they were in half- stop increments.

If my above interpretation of his statement is correct, then it renders the M7's AE function essentially useless for my needs. But, this rumor is certainly at least now mre believable, especially given Leica's history on innovative system updates!

;-),

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), February 07, 2002.

Sorry for the double post -- the server acted like it didn't accept the first one...

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), February 07, 2002.

A rumble in the forest eh? By the sounds of the M7 I'm glad I got the M6 recently, and I plan to keep it although I can return it for a cash refund. One of the reasons I got the M6 was for its simplicity, having come from Canon 1N. But, I'm sure there are photogs out there with Leica glass and a need for such capability. Have fun...

-- James (snodoggydogg@hotmail.com), February 07, 2002.

Of course this is premature but so far it sounds like it's not just a re-badged Hexar. Too bad.

-- Jay (infinitydt@aol.com), February 07, 2002.

I'll tell right now, Giles, If I have to come all the way over to Epping to sort you out, I'll be right pissed off.

-- rob (rob@robertappleby.com), February 07, 2002.

Rob, I'm not sure what all this is about. I was simply curious if you have a connection with the Epping Forest area as I am very familiar with it.

-- Giles Poilu (giles@monpoilu.icom43.net), February 07, 2002.

I'm going to add my 2 cents for what it's worth. I consider the horizontal shutter paramount to the Leica experience. The only shutter capable of resolving complex scenes, with movement, at very slow shutter speeds. Destroy the horizontal cloth shutter, and you destroy the Leica RF (In my un-humble opinion.) Twenty years ago, the Pentax LX was designed with a metal, horizontal, electronically controled shutter. The sync was 1/70. To go higher requires a vertical shutter. Obviously, you morons can see that a horizontal shutter moves twice as far as a vetical shutter. So just changing the existing shutter from a horizontal to a vetical should increase the sync speed to 1/125. But don't think there won't be a price to be paid. Personally, I'll never go vertical. So there!

-- Glenn Travis (leicaddict@hotmail.com), February 07, 2002.

Don't try to wriggle out of it Giles,you were giving Rob dirty looks and chatting-up his woman.LEAVE IT OUT!!!!!!!

-- Virgil (leicavirgin@hotmail.com), February 07, 2002.

Check this out: http://www.leicacamera.com/cgi- bin/site_forum_main.pl?1*detail*1012863600_6.

-- Hoyin Lee (leehoyin@hutchcity.com), February 07, 2002.

"Obviously, you morons can see that a horizontal shutter moves twice as far as a vetical shutter."

Uh yeahhhh... dat's write for sure dude... everybody knows that 36mm is twice as far as 24mm...

Who's the moron???

;-),

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), February 07, 2002.

Well while we are on the rumor mill, I quote from the link above

"as far as she knows, the M6 will be carried for quite some time as the 'all mechanical' alternative as Leica evaluates M7 acceptance/sales."

The End is Nigh... :-(

-- Mani Sitaraman (bindumani@pacific.net.sg), February 07, 2002.

No, the end is not nigh. Get ready for an M6-2 followed by an M6-P. Then in about 10 years, we will have an M8.

-- Pete (Leica_RF@yahoo.com), February 07, 2002.

>>> the Pentax LX was designed with a metal, horizontal, electronically controled shutter. The sync was 1/70. To go higher requires a vertical shutter.<<<

Not so. The Leicaflex cameras have horizontal-travel cloth shutters with a sync speed of 1/100 sec.

-- Douglas Herr (telyt@earthlink.net), February 07, 2002.

"...the end is nigh..." time to stock up on the M6 bodies! me, I'll probably grab a couple more before leica is no longer leica! ; )

-- James (snodoggydogg@hotmail.com), February 07, 2002.

"...the end is nigh..."

Dang... The USED M6's I just sold are going ot be worth a LOT more next month!

:-),

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), February 07, 2002.

Patience, patience, patience.... There are only 16 days left until PMA!! Just sit back and RELAX...

-- Albert Knapp MD (albertknappmd@mac.com), February 07, 2002.

"2 mechnical speeds" in an electronic shutter makes more sense than "aperture-priority only on two" speeds in a mechnical shutter.

But who sed Leica ever made sense?

16 days and we'll know.....

-- Andy Piper (apidens@denver.infi.net), February 08, 2002.

It's still 16 days... Mom, when will it be zero days?

-- Mani Sitaraman (bindumani@pacific.net.sg), February 08, 2002.

Where's Epping Forest? Is it near Sherwood Forest? I'd rather meet in Sherwood Forest. Is there really such a place as Sherwood forest? Where is that? And where's Camelot? And why are Leicas not produced in Camelot? Could we have the M7 showing there?

-- Bob Fleischman (RFXMAIL@prodigy.net), February 08, 2002.

Streuth, it doesn't pay to write anything in anymore, and it's almost starting to pay not to read either, what with everyone getting off the track. Where did al these pissed off blokes come from? Next time Mark, just give us an email. Anyway, it'l be a long time before the 7's hit Oz.

-- Paul Nelson (clrfarm@westnet.com.au), February 09, 2002.

Now we can start criticising the M7 BEFORE it's released, why not speculate on the M8 as well? To be released in Epping Forest in 2010, I presume?

-- David Killick (dalex@inet.net.nz), February 09, 2002.

Funny thing. Today I am shooting my 30 year old Leica M5. No one had anything good to say about it until it was 20 years old. Now everyone loves them.

-- Mark (Leica_M5@msn.com), February 09, 2002.