OH Dear not fully manual,not fully electronic.A mismatch,take a way fully manual M6 and what have we got....a little lost soul.Not a nikon,not a leica but a little lost soul,who is not sure what he is.Can you help, we will buy him anyway ,he was made by Leica.But do not make anymore lost souls.we might get bored,like we did with the R range.

-- allen herbert (allen1@btinternet.com), March 11, 2002

Answers

For the love of god, SHUT UP! I try to be tolerant of pointless posting, but this endless trolling is idiotic. Don't like the M7? Don't buy one!!!! [heavy sigh]

-- Mike Dixon (mike@mikedixonphotography.com), March 11, 2002.

Yes, please go away w/ these inane postings. Ridiculous, ridiculous.

-- Patrick (pg@patrickgarner.com), March 11, 2002.

Er, Mind you: The R system is good for what it is meant, taking photos. It looks boring because it's a good system and it has been offered in other brand such as Canon or Nikon, what ever. I've got a R7 nad it's fine.

Now, the "soul" can be declined in two ways. a) the capacity of a lens of rendering a good image on a 24x36mm. Sharpness, colors, etc. b) the capacity of creating a class of "snobs", having bought their ticket through heavy mortgage.

Yes, I'm very harsh tonite!!

If the "soul" you mention is the capacity to use a very manual system, just go for Linhoff or Alpa (in wood, lovely!). By the size of the neg, the quality shall be excellent and the manipulation of a large format chmaber is quite an experience.

A flame? Nah, it ain't a flame, just a nice exchange between two amateurs.

Cheers. X.

-- Xavier d'Alfort (hot_billexf@hotmail.com), March 11, 2002.

And you post topical interesting subjects,or are you trying to get people to look at your photos on your non functional web-site.Did you do the web-site as well as the photos.It follows.

-- allen herbert (allen1@btinternet.com), March 11, 2002.

Enough of this nonsense. This is the third post in a day or two on the same stupid subject. There is nothing new to be said.

-- Eliot (erosen@lij.edu), March 11, 2002.

Allen and Alfie should get together and have tea sometime.

-- Richard (rvle@yahoo.com), March 11, 2002.

And you post topical interesting subjects,or are you trying to get people to look at your photos on your non functional web-site.Did you do the web-site as well as the photos.It follows.

I'm posting about the performance, capabilities, and use of Leica lenses in response to requests for that information. I would consider that far more topical than posting three threads in two days simply bitching about a camera which I don't even own.

You are the first person to report that my website isn't working. I'll look into it. And yes, I did do the website.

-- Mike Dixon (mike@mikedixonphotography.com), March 11, 2002.

You do not have to read them,and by the way we are in a democratic country,free speech etc.

-- allen herbert (allen1@btinternet.com), March 11, 2002.

Unfortunately Allen it's garbage like this that gives free speech a bad name.

-- Bob Todrick (bobtodrick@yahoo.com), March 11, 2002.

Just checked my site--was working fine. If anyone else has difficulties with it, please let me know.

Allen (phil?), democracy and free speech are not the relevant issues. Besides, you have already made your feelings on this topic known repeatedly--even own a privately-funded and moderated board, you have been allowed to express your beliefs. The issue is one of pointless and repeated trolling. You have no fundamental right to stir up trouble simply to amuse yourself. Ultimately, it's Tony's decision whether you stay or go.

-- Mike Dixon (mike@mikedixonphotography.com), March 11, 2002.

I guess we need to give this week's Alfie Wang brass doorknob award to allen. Maybe he will move on to the C**** forum too.

-- Dan Brown (brpatent@swbell.net), March 11, 2002.

Unfortunately Allen it's garbage like this that gives free speech a bad name.

Bob: Copyright and print this as a bumper sticker ASAP! GREAT!

:-))),

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), March 11, 2002.

We are getting heavy.The reason i said your site was not working is it is not fully functional,sorry if i mislead.As far as stirring up trouble, i actually own a M6,AND I AM CONCERNED THAT LEICA IS MOVING AWAY FRON A 50 YEAR TRADITION. As far as i can see Leica is gradually moving towards fully auto,i am putting my opion that is a bad thing for Leica.If you do not want to read what i am saying press the off switch.You Know a Tony who maybe owns the site,therefore you feel you are a head boy.Can i make suggestion to you,buy and use a Leica then you will be in a better position to govern what users are saying.That is if you still want to be head boy or got time. Regards Allen

-- allen herbert (allen1@btinternet.com), March 11, 2002.

Never been a yes man, or followed the crowd, sorry if this problem to some.

-- allen herbert (allen1@btinternet.com), March 11, 2002.

No Allen, I think the problem has to do more with your not knowing what your talking about, and using a public forum to express your uniformed views. This said, everyone has the right to express thier views once, it's the repition that makes you look idiotic.

-- Bob Todrick (bobtodrick@yahoo.com), March 11, 2002.

The reason i said your site was not working is it is not fully functional,sorry if i mislead.

What isn't functioning? It's been a while since the last update, and I think all the links and image maps go where they should.

Can i make suggestion to you,buy and use a Leica then you will be in a better position to govern what users are saying.

Aha! I see that you haven't even read my posts; you've just bitched about them.

Never been a yes man, or followed the crowd, sorry if this problem to some.

Yeah, that's it--we're all intimidated by your profound and original insights (which you keep repeating over and over and over). Take a look through the archives; you're not saying anything new. All you're doing is saying it in a particularly annoying manner . . .

-- Mike Dixon (mike@mikedixonphotography.com), March 11, 2002.

Hehehe...this is somewhat amusing. A bit like my rants about 75 luxes! Well, not quite as bad. Anyway, I do like the fully manual M6 TTL, that's why I bought one instead of waiting a month or two to go M7. I like the idea of the M7 as well! To me, the most important part of the M system are the lenses! The comapctness and quietness of the M system is still there, it's just that Leica integrated an AE mode. What's so bad about that? Perhaps you should buy up the remaining stock of M6's so you'll never be out of that certain model until you die.

Is Leica going the wrong way with lenses such as the 35 lux asph and the 90 APO asph? Heck no! New computations and technology well applied to improve their system.

-- James (snodoggydogg@hotmail.com), March 11, 2002.

Allen, you've made a couple interesting points today (I liked the "wagging tail" metaphor earlier), but you've gone over the edge which hinders your credibility and sincerity. Kind of like a bull in a closet full of Leicas. Many of us have a bit of a "traditional v. gadgetry" struggle, but you're trying to jam "your struggle" down the throats of some very authoritative and extremely competent folks here. Please don't stir up our forum. Show us some pictures with your M6.

-- Tony Rowlett (rowlett@mail.com), March 11, 2002.

Mike,

Your website works just fine.

Anam

-- Anam Alpenia (aalpenia@dasar.com), March 11, 2002.

Tony, please delete this entire thread. It really serves no purpose at all in the long (or the short) run.

-- Mani Sitaraman (bindumani@pacific.net.sg), March 11, 2002.

Mani's suggestion sounds like a good one. Considering that, in his first post two days ago, Allen was asking about the suitability of the M vs. R for his shooting, yesterday he had made the decision to go with an M, and today he's an experienced M6 owner worried about Leica's glorious tradition, it seems pretty obvious we're dealing with a pure-bred troll.

-- Mike Dixon (mike@mikedixonphotography.com), March 11, 2002.

If ever a thread deserved deletion, it's this one!

-- Tom Bryant (boffin@gis.net), March 11, 2002.

Mike / Bob:

Please excuse me, but I'm really surprised that you have time available for this .... I don't know what !

The same wise conclusion has appeared time and again in previous similar situations: don't bother to answer what is not worth the effort. In fact, I'm doing exactly that, only that I couldn't help writting this today when I saw YOU involved in such a time wasting exchange.

Might I suggest that we just show the back to postings which really deserve it.

Regards, gentlemen. Smile . . .

-Iván

-- Iván Barrientos M (ingenieria@simltda.tie.cl), March 11, 2002.

Nice Bum Ivan. What are you doing Saturday night?

-- Wilhelm (wmitch3400@hotmail.com), March 11, 2002.

Ivan, do you have a model release for that shot? ; )

I agree that this is a ridiculous waste of time. However, I'm currently at the computer engaged in an exceedingly tedious bit of work, so it's nice to swing over for a few minutes and blow off a little steam. I suspect that, before my job is complete, I'll have also scrubbed my toilet, waxed the table, and sorted through the past two weeks of mail.

-- Mike Dixon (mike@mikedixonphotography.com), March 11, 2002.

"low case" allen still hasn't admitted that an M7 can be used in purely a manual mode (a la M6 or M6 TTlL) as well as in an AE mode. Let's face it ; his mother was frightened by an alkaline76 battery in the delivery room. < g >

In a lighter mood: I was listening to Neeme Jarvis' complete edition of Grieg's Peer Gynt (DG 423079-2) earlier this evening, and when the CD progressed to the "Hall of The Mountain King," with all of those little trolls running around inside the mountain, I thought fondly of "allen." He is the troll supreme.

-- George C. Berger (gberger@his.com), March 11, 2002.

Well, gentlemen, Mike is not the only one around who knows beatiful ladies, OK ?

Envious, Wilhelm . . .?

-Iván

-- Iván Barrientos M (ingenieria@simltda.tie.cl), March 11, 2002.

This topic is old now. Either you like it or you don't. Only ime and sales records will tell.

-- Kristian (leicashot@hotmail.com), March 11, 2002.

Show us some pictures with your M6.

He doesn't seem like the type that takes pictures, based on prior experience with these types of threads.

-- Jeff Spirer (jeff@spirer.com), March 11, 2002.

Gentlemen:

I beg your indulgence. "allen" lower case, can not show us his pictures as he does not believe in new technology. Scanners have come out since his "new" M6 which is at most 18 years old. In addition his "new" M6 is new technology compared to the I, II and III series cameras. IF he shows us any pictures "scanned" we can then flame him for not being willing to change.

Cheers. ;)

-- Mark A. Johnson (logical1@catholic.org), March 11, 2002.

Didn't this thread just start this morning? It's old and deleteable already? Geez...like I miss a whole thread while I'm eating lunch these days.

I was going to add something profound, like didn't all this get said 20 years ago when Leica introduced an M6 with built-in light meter. Or wasn't this lament from 50 years ago when Leica went from the sane screw mount body to that monstrous M3.

However, I think I'm too late. Noone gives a rat's ass anymore. Goodnight everyone.

-- Ken Shipman (kennyshipman@aol.com), March 11, 2002.

I thought fondly of "allen Thanks George i feel the same way about you,hows the head-boy doing

-- allen herbert (allen1@btinternet.com), March 12, 2002.

Is he still looking for his toilet roll.

-- allen herbert (allen1@btinternet.com), March 12, 2002.

Sirs, please, we are gentlemen, aren't we? Every one has the right to express his/her own opinion and the duty to compose his/her style in a civil way! In my humble opinion, I think the market will give the answer. But not only the market, the real use of the gear... after one or two years from the issue of the new camera. All the best, Joe

-- Joe Pelizza Salusso di Volpedo (breglumasi@hotmail.com), March 12, 2002.

I don't understand this. Just because the M7 has aperture priority auto mode doesn't mean that you have to use it. In manual mode it works just like an M6TTL. There are other benefits. Either you think that they are worth buying it for, or you don't. I do.

Nigel

-- Nigel Bowley (nigel.bowley@btinternet.com), March 12, 2002.

Only on two shutter speeds,the M8 will will work on none.Does it matter,yes, to the purist thats why other companies are rushing in on this market.They are not stupid,and they have done plenty of market research.Nickon does not produceA NEW MANUAL CAMERA for sentimental reasons or volt or hex,they do it for the money.And they are doing very well with these new products.And the special nice spin off is they can finish off LEICA FOR GOOD.Then they can get back to producing plastic rubbish and make real money.What choice will you have.And Nikon will not have to bother making metal bodied cameras,and canon can wipe the thought out of their mind.They can all make cheap plassy cameras with with a few extra bells each month and make loads of money.If you do not like there plassies well what a shame,take up knitting.The only camera manufactures in the world the Japananese.I do not think even they would like that idea.But if everyone else is that stupid...so be it.Think, Leica produce very high quality products that is the only way they can compete,they have not the money for high tec RD.Get it right I think JAPANESE CAMERAS ARE SUPERB but me, like them ,like to see someone else in the market.

-- allen herbert (allen1@btinternet.com), March 12, 2002.

fOOTNOTE

they are also among the biggest buyers of LEICAS.APART FROM usa.

-- allen herbert (allen1@btinternet.com), March 12, 2002.

Allen, Mike is a fantastic contributor to this forum. Just becuase your post isn't as well taken as some of his doesn't mean you can insult his work and website. His posts recently have been showing the technical attributes of lenses, a topic most of us find interesting. The fact that he knows what he is doing and takes great pics is a bonus.

Though Mike could've been a little nicer in his first reply post. The fact is that some of us need to express our opinions, and sometimes indifferntly to others. We must respect each others' opinions and move on. If we don't like it, there is no need to be rude about it. Why are we all getting so frustrated over words from people that we've never met and play no real signifcant influence or part in our lives.

Let's try to get along, at least like 12 year olds.

-- Kristian (leicashot@hotmail.com), March 12, 2002.

I agee.18 plus would be better.Remeber where the first stone came from.As far as Mikes work is concerned, i have looked at his web- site,i thought the photos on it were very good,i liked the street shots.aIthought the first shot on the site was out of focus .Maybe soft focus, still does not look good.Now you Americans and us Brits know by now if someone comes along and pokes us with a sharp stick we better respond.By not doing so, is not seen as turn the other cheek, but weak.I must say a little gang of you were starting to get blood hungrey....well you know the response.Remember, where the first stone came from.Having said all that i felt it was a bit of harmless banter,and i have no bad feelings towards anyone. Regards Allen

-- allen herbert (allen1@btinternet.com), March 12, 2002.

Mike's a photographer. What he says about this topic has far more to do than what a bunch of camera weenies think.

-- Jeff Spirer (jeff@spirer.com), March 12, 2002.

Yes i love Mike to,can we shut up about it now and move on.

-- allen herbert (allen1@btinternet.com), March 13, 2002.

can we shut up about it now and move on.

Damn!! That's what I should have said in the first place!

Oh, wait . . .

-- Mike Dixon (mike@mikedixonphotography.com), March 13, 2002.