Hi all,

I just order my 0.58 M7 & Summicron 28 last week, and when I saw the M7 (0.72), the on-off switch seem made of plastic... And it doesn't feel really sturdy.. Comments (from M7 users:-) are welcome about this.. thanks in advance..

Best regards,

-- Simon.

-- Simon Alibert (s_alibert@mac.com), April 29, 2002

Answers

Not sure what its made of but it does what its suppose to as far as I'm concerned.

-- John Abela (jamriman@yahoo.com), April 29, 2002.

It would be a shame if Leica have added yet another plastic part to the camera which could have easily been metal.

-- Karl Yik (karl.yik@dk.com), April 29, 2002.

Is there any engineering reason why metal would be better than plastic?

-- rob (rob@robertappleby.com), April 29, 2002.

Not really, just that metal gives a better sense of quality, (hence the reason why Leica dont use plastics as their body and lens shells like other camera manufacturers, but there seems to be more and more plastic replacements (or enancements?) like the film wind lever having a plastic end, the viewfinder selector having a plastic insert and now the plastic on/off switch, which in my mind means that Leica is trying to cut costs by using cheaper alternatives.

-- Karl Yik (karl.yik@dk.com), April 29, 2002.

>>> there seems to be more and more plastic replacements (or enancements?) like the film wind lever having a plastic end, the viewfinder selector having a plastic insert and now the plastic on/off switch, which in my mind means that Leica is trying to cut costs by using cheaper alternatives.

Uh, the plastic on the wind lever and preview lever were added with the introduction of the M4, circa 1968. The changes were not financial - they were cosmetic, and in the case of the wind lever, functional. The M7 on/off switch, now that's a new item.

-- Kent Phelan (kent@phelan.org), April 29, 2002.

I would have though using injection moulding for unstressed parts is just good sense. The preview lever insert - what difference does it make whether it's metal or plastic? None, except that it would probably make the camera cost $50 more if it was metal. The wind-on lever tip is probably better in plastic, especially in very cold weather. So long as the camera does the job, who cares whether it's metal or plastic?

-- rob (rob@robertappleby.com), April 29, 2002.

So you're saying that if the M6 was made in flimsy, creaky, light black plastic youd still buy it? And I am comparing the current plastickly bits to that of the M2 and M3, the greatest all metal Ms that Leica made.

-- Karl Yik (karl.yik@dk.com), April 29, 2002.

Carl, I'd buy it if it did the job. Plastic has many mechanical advantages over metal, when used appropriately. Plus a cost advantage, I would have thought.

-- rob (rob@robertappleby.com), April 29, 2002.

For instance, if the rewind knob was plastic, it wouldn't bend out of shape when impacted, but would absorb the shock elastically. Plastic is a good material.

-- rob (rob@robertappleby.com), April 29, 2002.

Plastic has many mechanical advantages over metal, when used appropriately.

When used appropriately, indeed. For buttons and body casings, maybe. But for a part subjected to repeated back-and-forth stresses like an on-off switch? Sorry but I think metal would be better in this case. I'd also prefer the rewind knob to be (softer) metal, because even if it gets bent it can still work. If the plastic (or brittle metal) one breaks, good luck getting your film out of your camera.

Plus a cost advantage, I would have thought.

Bingo! Too bad the cost advantage isn't reflected in the retail price! But that's another post altogether... :-)

-- Anon Terry (anonht@yahoo.com), April 29, 2002.

Metal is better because it lasts longer.

-- Dan Brown (brpatent@swbell.net), April 29, 2002.

Rob, yes you are right from a functional point of view, they should use whatever works best, but Leica wouldnt be Leica if they were made from plastic. Cameras are very tactile objects, similar to lets say a Rolex watch. Metals give an object a better sense of solidity longevity (and perhaps worth?) that plastic cant.

-- Karl Yik (karl.yik@dk.com), April 29, 2002.

The on-off switch on my M7 seems to be metal, and seems sturdy. SN27776xx.

-- Robert Rose (camerabug99@hotmail.com), April 29, 2002.

Also metal gains a unique patina with age, just like leather.

-- Karl Yik (karl.yik@dk.com), April 29, 2002.

There're all kinds of plastic. Some degrade in heat and sunlight, becoming soft and gooey. Other types get brittle. Plastic for switches, knobs, buttons, and levers is a bad idea when metal is cheaply available, longer lasting and easily stamped,extruded, cast, machined etc.

-- Fred Sun (redsky3@yahoo.com), April 29, 2002.

The on/off switch on my M7 appears to be metal. God, I never cease to be amazed at the things we can find to argue about on here!

-- Paul Chefurka (paul@chefurka.com), April 29, 2002.

Karl,

Does that make the Timex G-Shock the equivelent of the F100, while Leica remains the Rolex of the small format time-keeping world?

-- Anam Alpenia (aalpenia@dasar.com), April 29, 2002.

I did not do the "tap it against my front tooth" metal-or-plastic- test of the on-off switch on the M7 I had for the day but if it is causing problems it is no doubt more to do with the way it is engineered internally than the material the external tab and ring are made of. The dials and switches of many Japanese SLRs are plastic (so are the Leica R's)and tend to be trouble-free. Occasionally, as in the case of the EOS A2 (EOS 5 outside the USA)there is a problem...in that case related to engineering more than materials. Canon redesigned the switch, still plastic, and now it is bug-free.

-- Jay (infinitydt@aol.com), April 29, 2002.

I think the metal vs. plastic issue also has to depend on which metal vs. which plastic. I suppose an ABS plastic or a polycarbonate might be preferable to certain metals.

-- Bob Fleischman (RFXMAIL@prodigy.net), May 01, 2002.

Bob Fleischman is exactly right - there are many different types of plastic, with widely differing properties. Not all plastics are brittle, just as not all plastics are soft and gooey. For example, handgun frames made of plastic (e.g. Glock) have been in use for many years and have proved to be very strong and resilient. Anyway, FWIW I understand that the on/off switch of the Leica M7 is made of metal.

-- Ray Moth (ray_moth@yahoo.com), May 01, 2002.