Greetings,

I wondered if there is anyone here who is learned in the Catholic inner-healing/deliverance ministry? I would greatly appreciate the sharing of documents and Teachings, including Sacred Scripture, which differentiate the ministry of deliverance from the rite of exorcism, most especially those areas which show that priests who are not appointed as exorcists by bishops, and experienced laity, may perform a non-liturgical deliverance. Thanks so much for any input. Many blessings to you and yours,

Charlotte

http://www.ewtn.com/library/CURIA/CDFHEAL.HTM

-- Charlotte (rosaryqueen@clarityconnect.com), November 08, 2002

Answers

Greetings T

A very unusual question, indeed.

-- - (1@.....), November 08, 2002.

Hello...what's your name?

My question is unusual? How so?

Background info: My husband and I have been in this ministry for some years. When a moderator at another forum claimed that non-bishop- appointed priests, Catholic laity, and Protestants, etc., may not nor are allowed to perform a deliverance because no one other than a bishop-appointed exorcist may use the words, "In the Name of Jesus," and that the CCC doesn't lay out specifics on this subject (so, if it isn't in the CCC, it's heretical), I presented all the teachings I could find from reliable resources (Cardinal Ratzinger as well as other well-known priests, and Sacred Scripture), but was completely censored because I could not show precisely where the Church teaches that this is allowed.

The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith lays out disciplinary norms in the INSTRUCTION ON PRAYERS FOR HEALING (14 September 2000). But this moderator failed to understand the difference between a non- liturgical healing and the liturgical rite of exorcism. Deliverance and inner-healing are not performed through a liturgical rite.

It would appear that no one here has any extensive knowledge on this subject. But I thank all of you for allowing me to post my question.

God bless you all abundantly.

-- Charlotte (rosaryqueen@clarityconnect.com), November 09, 2002.

Dear Charlotte, This is not an unusual request at all. There is much to be learned about this, as people today are finding themselves in such need for healing and deliverance, and desiring to approach the throne of God confidently as we are encouraged to do all throughout scripture. This topic has been discussed here before in depth, maybe others can direct you in finding those discussions.

I've discovered a fresh hunger in Catholics in many different circles, aware of 'working out their salvation', thus causing them to look inward more deeply toward their own sanctification. This is of course a serious matter and one we're exhorted to look into. I've found in my own experience the closer I walk with Jesus, I have seen more clearly my own need of healing and in the beginning of my journey with Him the need of minor deliverance. This, of course, takes discernment and teaching to be able to distinguish which is needed and when. It also takes much prayer, and sound, trustworthy, mature and experienced teachers.

The whole topic of Demonology is significant, especially in light of today's culture of death. It's a topic Catholics should be aware of, so we can be equipped for every good work the Lord would have for us in building up the Church. I went through a 3-year course, ending last year, one of Father Peter Sander's {oratorian} Healing and Deliverance Institutes here in California. His new book, *Healing in the Spirit of Jesus: a practical guide for ministry*, the first of three volumes, just went to press and should be on the market in a few months.

You may go into any Catholic [and many Christian, not specifically Cath] bookstore, and find much written on the topic, by sound, orthodox, well documented Catholics, both priests and laity. Fr. Robert De Grandis has at least a dozen, including the healing ministry for the layperson. Francis MacNutt has one of the best in my opinion.Mike Scanlon,TOR, has an excellent book teaching discernment of spirits.You may also learn much from Fr. John Hampsch,CMF and Fr. Matt Linn.

Charlotte, why do you ask? Do you sense a call to the ministry, or are you just curious? In Christ, Theresa

-- Theresa Huether (Rodntee4Jesus@aol.com), November 09, 2002.

Charlotte, we wrote at the same time. May I share few more thoughts, after reading your second post I think I can understand a little of what you may be asking for. Spiritual warfare is no game, and not to be toyed with, as I sense you know. But conversely, we see the need to be equipped, the Lord is looking for laborers in this field, the harvest is ready! Our youth are dying. It's no joke. We have been blessed with good Catholic leaders in this ministry, but it may be a fresh work of the Holy Spirit, one in which we must press on in prayer about. He will lead His people.Many priests are unable to help, or they're afraid to.

We were at a retreat for 20 college students over the summer. At one point of prayer, one young girl layed out on the floor and began manifesting demon activity.Our priest had just left for home with an attack of sciatica. If there wouldn't have been a few of us lay people there knowing what to do, it could've been quite disturbing, never mind terrifying. I speak of this to bring to light the fact that we may be in situations, especially today when youth are experimenting freely with witchcraft and the occult, thereby opening themselves wide for demonic entrance, where we'll need to know what to do, and what not to do.

I pray soon our priests for the most part, including our bishops, have a release in the Holy Spirit in this area, and they themselves will be equipped to teach us more. It's an exciting time to be alive in the service of Jesus and the coming of His kingdom. love,in Him, Theresa

-- Theresa Huether (Rodntee4Jesus@aol.com), November 09, 2002.

Hello, Theresa,

How kind of you to post a response! I had begun to think that no one at this community was involved in either spiritual warfare or the healing ministry. I can't tell you how relieved I am to know that I have finally found a forum where I can share these things!

I have felt strongly impelled to witness to other Catholics that inner-healing and deliverance truly are available if they have a need. I know that countless Catholics and non-Catholics lurk at several Catholic forums in hopes of finding help for their spiritual dilemmas. Since I am no longer able to be physically active in the ministry, I feel that the Lord has guided me to post responses and educate those who have courage enough to ask questions about spiritual deliverance. Yet, in their ignorance, moderators censor and verbally abuse those who are able to help God's Children to find the help they seek. After such a serious misinterpretation by the moderator of the previous forum at which I had regularly posted, as well as the excessively unbalanced response, the original poster was, unfortunately, frightened away.

Also unfortunate is the rise of those who need deliverance because of involvement in the occult. I thought that it was serious in the '60s. But here we are at the advent of the 21st century, and the practice of the occult has become more widespread than ever. Our young simply do not realize the danger they place themselves in when toying with these practices. Hollywood makes it all so attractive and even beneficial with programs like "Charmed" and "Buffy the Vampire Slayer." Wicca is seen as benevolent white magic, allegedly opposite of evil black magic. But all sources of power which are not of God are absolutely evil. The evil one is having a hay-day with our youth. And the Church needs ministers to bring them back to Christ and wholeness.

I am almost 50 years old, and a convert at the age of 28. The Holy Spirit guided me ultimately into this ministry through many years of searching, and what seems like coincidence; but of course, God knew where He was leading me. There is no one better to administer inner- healing and deliverance than one who has been delivered as well. I, too, as well as my husband, had been involved in the occult when we were teenagers. God delivered me through my baptism and confirmation, although at the time I could not define in words what He had done for me. It wasn't until later that I finally understood.

All Christians were given the ability to exorcise or deliver in Christ's name (Mark 16:15 - 18; Luke 10:17; Mark 9:38 -39). It was not until much later in the Church that exorcism was done by specific priests. Yet, Protestants don't have recourse to a Catholic exorcist-- for exorcism or deliverance and inner-healing. "...Jesus handed down the power to drive out demons to the twelve apostles first, then to the seventy-two disciples, and, finally, to all those who believe in him." (Father Amorth, An Exorcist Tells His Story, p. 173.) The Catholic Church does not teach that other Christians do not have this authority.

"It is obvious that not only Catholics but everyone who believes in Christ has the power to expel demons in his name. We must not be jealous of anyone else, but should look to the Gospel for guidance. When John told Jesus, 'We saw a man casting out demons in your name, and we forbade him because he was not following us,' the Lord rebuked the apostles (Mark 9:38 - 40). These prayers must be guided by precise rules, but they are extremely efficacious. Cardinal Suenens wrote a book specifically to regulate such prayers, _Renewal and the Power of Darkness_ (Pauline Editions, 1982), with a foreword by Cardinal Ratzinger. He writes, 'At the beginning, many Catholics tied to the renewal movement discovered the practice of deliverance among Christians of other traditions, belonging mainly to the Free Churches or Pentecostals. The books that they read, and still read, for the most part come from these denominations. Among their literature there is an enormous wealth of information on the devil and his acolytes, on witchcraft and its methodology, and so forth. In the Catholic Church, this field has been left almost fallow. Our directives for specific pastoral response are inadequate for our times' (pp. 79 - 80)." (Amorth, p. 173.)

"Over the course of centuries, several factors led to the gradual narrowing of exorcism to a specially appointed group of exorcists. We can easily see why. For one thing, it is a difficult ministry. Even the apostles were unable to exorcise the epileptic demoniac, and they were rebuked by Jesus for being insufficiently prepared through prayer and fasting (Matthew 17:20 -21).

"As a result of these dangers, Cyprian (died a martyr A.D. 258) wrote in the third century about a false prophetess who acted as if she were inspired by the Holy Spirit. Then an exorcist showed up, 'a man approved,' who discerned that she was really inspired by a wicked spirit, and not the Holy Spirit. Writes Evelyn Frost:

"'This shows us that in the time of Cyprian there was an order of exorcists apparently regularized and approved by the Church. It is noteworthy that none of the 'very many brethren,' in spite of their strong faith, attempted to exorcise this woman, nor one of the priests, but they appealed to the exorcist. This may be an indication that by the middle of the third century, the practice of exorcism in the Church has been open to abuse and required regularizing.' (p. 133, Deliverance from Evil Spirits, Francis McNutt, Chosen Books, 1995.)

So, even by the third century, exorcism had not yet been regularized. The Church Fathers go on:

"The ministry of exorcism continued in the early Church. After Jesus' death Philip, the deacon ordained to oversee the distribution of bread, evangelized Samaria and made a great impact: 'With shrieks, evil spirits came out of many' (Acts 8:7).

"After the death of the apostles, exorcisms were carried out with no mention of any special class of Christians to whom the ministry of deliverance was restricted. In fact, the Church father Origen (martyred around A.D. 253) mentioned that many Christians cast out demons 'merely by prayer and simple adjurations which the plainest person can use. Because, for the most part, it is unlettered (or illiterate) persons who perform this work.' Origen added that exorcism does 'not require the power and wisdom of those who are mighty in argument.'

"Justin Martyr (who wrote still earlier, around A.D. 150) states that 'many Christian men' exorcise demons that cannot be cast out by pagans. Women cast out demons, too, women like St. Eugenia in the third century.

"Incidentally, both Justin Martyr and Irenaeus (who wrote around A.D. 180) believed that Jews could perform exorcisms in the name of the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

"Tertullian (who wrote around A.D. 200) went so far as to say that the noblest Christian life is 'to exorcise evil spirits--to perform cures...to live to God.' In his book The Shows he tried to convince pagans that there was more true enjoyment in casting out evil spirits and healing the sick than in attending the pagan plays and shows of the day." (McNutt, p. 131.)

"...The exorcise of deliverance ministry became more and more restricted (as things usually go in the history of the Church), until in the Middle Ages the priest became the normal minister of exorcism. Finally, in our own century, in the time of Pope Pius XI, the ministry of exorcism was limited to the priests.

"Much of this restriction was caused by centering on possession and on the increasing rarity of exorcism in European culture. Perhaps, too, the Roman Catholic Church was embarrassed by the excesses of the Inquisition and the burning of witches. In 1614, for example, the official Roman Ritual of the Roman Catholic Church declared that the exorcist should not easily believe that anyone is possessed, and it gave some highly unusual symptoms to tell whether a person was really possessed... Since these signs are so unusual, the diagnosis of possession naturally became rare, and removed exorcism from ordinary church life." (McNutt, p. 135.)

At any rate, the Holy Father exorts God's Children on the importance of healing and the healing ministry.

THE SICK NEED OUR HUMAN WARMTH Pope John Paul II http://www.ewtn.com/library/PAPALDOC/JP970209.HTM

Dear Brothers and Sisters,

1. ...If we pray with faith, the Lord will not fail to work miracles of healing even today. His Providence, however usually works through our responsible efforts and requires us to combat illness with all the resources of intellect, science and appropriate medical and social assistance.

2. Jesus' love for the sick encourages us especially to put the resources of our heart into action. We know from experience that, when we are ill, we not only need adequate treatment, but human warmth. Unfortunately in contemporary society we often risk losing genuine contact with others. The pace of work, stress or family crisis makes it increasingly difficult for us to give one another fraternal support. It is the weakest who pay the price. Thus it can happen that the elderly who are no longer self-sufficient, defenceless children, the disabled the severely handicapped and the terminally ill are sometimes seen as a burden and even an obstacle to be removed. On the other hand, walking at their side, dear brothers and sisters, helps build a society with a human face, enlivened by a deep sense of solidarity, where there is room and respect for all, especially the weakest.

3. Looking to Christ, physician of souls and bodies, we also meet the caring gaze of Mary, invoked by Christians as "Health of the sick", Salus infirmorum. May the Blessed Virgin help us touch the healing hand of her divine Son, welcome the saving power of the Gospel and become ourselves a concrete witness to all who need us.

Taken from: L'Osservatore Romano Weekly Edition in English 12 February 1997

Theresa, there is a confusion between "simple exorcism" which is (non- liturgical) deliverance and a "solemn exorcism" which is performed by a bishop-appointed exorcist priest in the liturgical rite.

"Many people who are unfamiliar with the deliverance ministry confuse it with solemn exorcism and therefore question whether it can be performed by laypersons or clergy without specific authorization. For these reasons, it is worthwhile to develop the authority for our position and practice.

"Solemn exorcism is for the purpose of driving out the devil from a possessed person. The Church requires that such exorcism be public, that is, that it be done in the name of and with the authority of the Church (from the Summa Theologia Moralis). Canon law requires that only a priest specifically approved by the local bishop can engage in public exorcism; therefore only such an authorized priest is approved for solemn exorcism (from Codex luris canonici).

"Simple exorcism, [this is what we call deliverance--cmc] however, is for the purpose of curbing the devil's power and can be executed through private exorcism, which means the exorcist acts in his own name. H. Noldin, a recognized moral theologian, writes: 'Private exorcism which truly is not sacramental can be executed by all the faithful... The effectiveness of this exorcism is not derived from the authority or prayers of the Church, nor is it done with the name of the Church, but in virtue of the name of God and Jesus Christ (from Summa Theologia Moralis)." (Father Michael Scanlon, TOR, Deliverance from Evil Spirits by Servant Books, 1980, p. 66.)

Father Gabriele Amorth, the Exorcist of Rome, has written two very authoritative books on the subject. Father Amorth wrote his two books because, in his expert opinion, he sees an increase in demonic activity throughout our earth, and he implores that good Christians become involved in these desperately needed ministries.

Father Amorth was appointed by the Pope's Vicar for the Diocese of Rome, Cardinal Ugo Poletti. He was granted the faculty of Exorcist and was initially assigned as Assistant to Father Candido Amantini, an expert Exorcist. When Father Amantini died, Father Amorth was given the Office of Chief Exorcist. Who can expel demons?

"I believe that I have made it sufficiently clear that Jesus gave the power to dispel demons to all those who believe in him and act in his name. I am referring to private prayer, which we can collectively call 'deliverance prayers.'

"Exorcists receive an additional, particular power. I am speaking of those priests who are specifically assigned by their Bishop. Using the formulas and prayers suggested by the Ritual, these priests administer a sacramental that, unlike private prayer, involves the intercession of the Church. "Much faith, much prayer, and fasting are always needed: on the part of both those who intercede and those for whom we intercede." (p. 153, An Exorcist Tells His Story, Ignatius Press, 1999.)

In Father Amorth's, An Exorcist: More Stories, he says, "We have discussed the fundamental importance of the power to cast out demons. It is a 'sign' that demonstrates that Christ is the stronger One; that he has the authority to destroy the kingdom of Satan, and to install the Kingdom of God; and that his preaching decisively points man toward God. To continue the work of humanity's redemption, to destroy Satan's works, and to free man from the slavery of the demon, this 'sign' had to continue. That is why Jesus handed down the power to drive out demons to the twelve apostles first, then to the seventy- two disciples, and, finally, to all those who believe in him.

"Mark mentions right away that the first power Jesus conferred on the apostles was that of casting out evil spirits." (Found in Mark 3:14 - 15.) (p. 43)

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Theresa, I have never heard of any courses in healing and deliverance, nor did I know there was an institute which teaches it! An individual in the ministry came to our parish and gave training to my husband and I, as well as several others, with our pastor present. How wonderful that there is an institute where folks can study this ministry! How does one take these courses? Do they offer correspondence courses?

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I'd really love to read them.

I apologize for such a long posting, but I wanted to share with you many of the things I had presented in the previous forum. I am incredibly frustrated that all I had presented was simply tossed aside by the moderator and webmaster.

Thanks so much for taking time to post a reply, Theresa. I look forward to hearing more about those courses and institute you mentioned. I shall definitely be looking for Father Peter Sander's book. God bless you abundantly!

-- Charlotte (rosaryqueen@clarityconnect.com), November 09, 2002.

Jmj

Hello, Charlotte.
I would like very much to respond to your initial questions -- and to comment on things that you added later. However, I find myself unable to begin without first asking you to amplify on something, so that I can better understand you.

You stated: "My husband and I have been in this [inner-healing/deliverance] ministry for some years."
And you stated: "[T]here is a confusion between 'simple exorcism' which is (non-liturgical) deliverance and a 'solemn exorcism' which is performed by a bishop-appointed exorcist priest in the liturgical rite. Many people who are unfamiliar with the deliverance ministry confuse it with solemn exorcism and therefore question whether it can be performed by laypersons or clergy without specific authorization. ... Solemn exorcism is for the purpose of driving out the devil from a possessed person. ... Simple exorcism, [this is what we call deliverance--cmc] however, is for the purpose of curbing the devil's power and can be executed through private exorcism, which means the exorcist acts in his own name."

Charlotte, what I need to ask you to do is to describe -- in as much detail as you possibly can -- at least two experiences, in which you took part, of what you have variously called inner-healing, deliverance, simple exorcism, and private exorcism.
I would very much like to learn who was involved (e.g., the human, angelic, demonic, and divine persons), where the events took place, who was present, what was said aloud (if anything) [this is most important], what event happened, how long the events took, and what caused them to come to an end. (When I ask "who was involved," I don't mean that I want names of the humans, but rather their vocations [lay/religious/clergy].)

At this forum, Charlotte, the Moderator will not delete your posts unless you violate the rules. I am quite sure that you have not violated them and that it is very unlikely that you will violate them in the future.

Thank you very much.
God bless you.
John

-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), November 10, 2002.

Hello, John, I beg your pardon, but are you one of the moderators? Or are you simply curious? Possibly, you are considering seeking this ministry because of a calling from the Holy Spirit? JMJ: 'You stated: "My husband and I have been in this [inner- healing/deliverance] ministry for some years."
' Yes. JMJ: 'Charlotte, what I need to ask you to do is to describe -- in as much detail as you possibly can -- at least two experiences, in which you took part, of what you have variously called inner-healing, deliverance, simple exorcism, and private exorcism.
' John: When one is in need of inner-healing (any "healing" other than physical), a deliverance (of evil spirits from obsession/oppression) at times is in order. To clarify: 1) deliverance, 2) simple exorcism and 3) private exorcism are one and the same: "deliverance." * This is done without benefit of liturgical rite--most frequently performed with and by a team (preferably with a priest present), with the laying on of hands (although not absolutely necessary, but one is usually able to discern more readily when laying hands on the individual who is in need of inner-healing and/or deliverance), a great deal of discernment from the team, and appropriate prayers. The prayers which are used are individualized. However, it is absolutely essential for the individual seeking deliverance to reject Satan and all his works. I regret that I am not able to disclose more than these generalities as it would violate the privacy of individuals who have sought counseling, prayer, inner-healing and/or deliverance, and because of possible prurient interest by others. But rest assured, with Jesus, Mary and Joseph as my witnesses, I have absolutely been involved in this ministry, and still have a heart for that involvement, albeit in a more theological, prayerful, and educational manner, rather than physical. The focus of my ministry is changing from direct to virtual involvement. I am now disabled, so am not able to be as physically active in the ministry as previously. At any rate, as I have already mentioned, each individual's situation is unique. We have done deliverances for both adults and children--experiences ranging from simple inner- healing of spirit and mind, to full deliverance of the manifestation of evil spirits because of an individual's previous involvement in the occult, or other sinful activity. JMJ: 'At this forum, Charlotte, the Moderator will not delete your posts unless you violate the rules. I am quite sure that you have not violated them and that it is very unlikely that you will violate them in the future.' Have I posted a subject that is normally inappropriate or taboo? Are you a moderator? Please pardon me if I have posted anything which is not acceptable by this forum. This was not my intent. I am simply seeking further information regarding the teachings of the Church and the inner-healing/deliverance ministry. Nothing more. As I am now disabled, as I have already stated, it has been necessary for me to change my focus from active physical involvement to sharing/teaching. There are far too many of God's Children who have no recourse to wholeness and healing because so many Catholics--laity, priests and bishops--no longer believe in the existence of the evil one. Father Gabriele Amorth (exorcist of Rome) has written in his book that, because of this serious problem, he has countless individuals from around the globe showing up on his doorstep, begging for his help. That's just wrong. This is not what Mother Church teaches, and it is abandonment of our sisters and brothers when they need us the most. Please let me know if you need any further enumeration or explanation. Many blessings to you and yours, John. Charlotte -- "Come unto Me, you who are mourning, who weep the loss of a son, a mother, a spouse, a brother . . . . Come, without delay, to My Tabernacle, all you whose dwelling has been marked by the cross of death and tears . . . . "Come lift up your hearts, for time is only a passing shadow, and heaven is eternal; arise, then, with courage and take the living Bread, My Eucharist, to fortify you in the struggle; come and I will reward you in the Paradise of My Heart which loves you!" (From the reflection 'Come Away With Me and Rest Awhile,' in the book Praying in the Presence of Our Lord for the Holy Souls). -- * "Solemn exorcism is for the purpose of driving out the devil from a possessed person. The Church requires that such exorcism be public, that is, that it be done in the name of and with the authority of the Church (from the Summa Theologia Moralis). Canon law requires that only a priest specifically approved by the local bishop can engage in public exorcism; therefore only such an authorized priest is approved for solemn exorcism (from Codex luris canonici). "Simple exorcism, [this is what we call deliverance--cmc] however, is for the purpose of curbing the devil's power and can be executed through private Exorcism, which means the exorcist acts in his own name. H. Noldin, a recognized moral theologian, writes: 'Private exorcism which truly is not sacramental can be executed by all the faithful... The effectiveness of this exorcism is not derived from the authority or prayers of the Church, nor is it done with the name of the Church, but in virtue of the name of God and Jesus Christ (from Summa Theologia Moralis)." (Father Michael Scanlon, TOR, Deliverance from Evil Spirits by Servant Books, 1980, p. 66.)

-- Charlotte (rosaryqueen@clarityconnect.com), November 11, 2002.

John, I apologize for the formatting of my previous posting! I should have paid attention. I wrote my comments on a text editor, and didn't notice until after I posted it that it neglected to insert the returns. Please allow me to re-post here. Thanks! Charlotte -- Hello, John, I beg your pardon, but are you one of the moderators? Or are you simply curious? Possibly, you are considering seeking this ministry because of a calling from the Holy Spirit? JMJ: 'You stated: "My husband and I have been in this [inner- healing/deliverance] ministry for some years."
' Yes. JMJ: 'Charlotte, what I need to ask you to do is to describe -- in as much detail as you possibly can -- at least two experiences, in which you took part, of what you have variously called inner-healing, deliverance, simple exorcism, and private exorcism.
' John: When one is in need of inner-healing (any "healing" other than physical), a deliverance (of evil spirits from obsession/oppression) at times is in order. To clarify: 1) deliverance, 2) simple exorcism and 3) private exorcism are one and the same: "deliverance." * This is done without benefit of liturgical rite--most frequently performed with and by a team (preferably with a priest present), with the laying on of hands (although not absolutely necessary, but one is usually able to discern more readily when laying hands on the individual who is in need of inner-healing and/or deliverance), a great deal of discernment from the team, and appropriate prayers. The prayers which are used are individualized. However, it is absolutely essential for the individual seeking deliverance to reject Satan and all his works. I regret that I am not able to disclose more than these generalities as it would violate the privacy of individuals who have sought counseling, prayer, inner-healing and/or deliverance, and because of possible prurient interest by others. But rest assured, with Jesus, Mary and Joseph as my witnesses, I have absolutely been involved in this ministry, and still have a heart for that involvement, albeit in a more theological, prayerful, and educational manner, rather than physical. The focus of my ministry is changing from direct to virtual involvement. I am now disabled, so am not able to be as physically active in the ministry as previously. At any rate, as I have already mentioned, each individual's situation is unique. We have done deliverances for both adults and children--experiences ranging from simple inner- healing of spirit and mind, to full deliverance of the manifestation of evil spirits because of an individual's previous involvement in the occult, or other sinful activity. JMJ: 'At this forum, Charlotte, the Moderator will not delete your posts unless you violate the rules. I am quite sure that you have not violated them and that it is very unlikely that you will violate them in the future.' Have I posted a subject that is normally inappropriate or taboo? Are you a moderator? Please pardon me if I have posted anything which is not acceptable by this forum. This was not my intent. I am simply seeking further information regarding the teachings of the Church and the inner-healing/deliverance ministry. Nothing more. As I am now disabled, as I have already stated, it has been necessary for me to change my focus from active physical involvement to sharing/teaching. There are far too many of God's Children who have no recourse to wholeness and healing because so many Catholics--laity, priests and bishops--no longer believe in the existence of the evil one. Father Gabriele Amorth (exorcist of Rome) has written in his book that, because of this serious problem, he has countless individuals from around the globe showing up on his doorstep, begging for his help. That's just wrong. This is not what Mother Church teaches, and it is abandonment of our sisters and brothers when they need us the most. Please let me know if you need any further enumeration or explanation. Many blessings to you and yours, John. Charlotte -- "Come unto Me, you who are mourning, who weep the loss of a son, a mother, a spouse, a brother . . . . Come, without delay, to My Tabernacle, all you whose dwelling has been marked by the cross of death and tears . . . . "Come lift up your hearts, for time is only a passing shadow, and heaven is eternal; arise, then, with courage and take the living Bread, My Eucharist, to fortify you in the struggle; come and I will reward you in the Paradise of My Heart which loves you!" (From the reflection 'Come Away With Me and Rest Awhile,' in the book Praying in the Presence of Our Lord for the Holy Souls). -- * "Solemn exorcism is for the purpose of driving out the devil from a possessed person. The Church requires that such exorcism be public, that is, that it be done in the name of and with the authority of the Church (from the Summa Theologia Moralis). Canon law requires that only a priest specifically approved by the local bishop can engage in public exorcism; therefore only such an authorized priest is approved for solemn exorcism (from Codex luris canonici). "Simple exorcism, [this is what we call deliverance--cmc] however, is for the purpose of curbing the devil's power and can be executed through private Exorcism, which means the exorcist acts in his own name. H. Noldin, a recognized moral theologian, writes: 'Private exorcism which truly is not sacramental can be executed by all the faithful... The effectiveness of this exorcism is not derived from the authority or prayers of the Church, nor is it done with the name of the Church, but in virtue of the name of God and Jesus Christ (from Summa Theologia Moralis)." (Father Michael Scanlon, TOR, Deliverance from Evil Spirits by Servant Books, 1980, p. 66.)

-- Charlotte (rosaryqueen@clarityconnect.com), November 11, 2002.

Charlotte, you indeed share alot of info. I suggest, to alleviate some frustration, that you continue to give this all back to the Lord,re-submit it.Is indeed His work, and as I said, He will lead us.I don't think you can get on a forum and expect to receive a certain immediate response. Unless people are called, and have previous experience and teaching in spiritual warfare,preferably from a priest, you will encounter those who are totally disoriented from it, and even resistant to it.

We cannot 'develop our authority' on anything, as you said. When the Lord shows us things, He usually leads us by the hand, and puts the proper authority in our lives, and shows us in the proper order how to proceed.

To be involved in healing and deliverance ministry is to be involved in a life-style, in a Christ-like mindset. It is to be involved in an intercessory network of people of one mind, in prayer and under the right authority, subject to the magesterium of course. People in the ministry I've met did not seek it out, quite contrarily, most say, 'no Lord, not me'.

Much groundwork has to be done. Here in nor-Cal we've been blest with many new Catholic prayer communities being set up, with intercession as their focus. It is from these communities, and the powerful prophetic prayer being raised up, that healing ministries are being developed and sent out. We cannot act on our own.

Intercessory prayer communities lay the ministry down, submit it to the Lord and to each other for discernment and correction constantly. I have a question regarding the individual that came to your parish and your pastor. What was the initial fruit of the visit? Did you form a prayer community? This would be the support you need.

Fr. Peter Sanders and team will not be doing the Institute in 2003, he is concentrating on writing, and doing workshops on the development of the charisms of the Holy Spirit. I believe his book will have much of the material from the institute in it. He uses the Catechism of the Catholic Church superbly and highlights its beauty and splendor and depth.He exhorts us to check our motives, and calls us to a life of prayer and obedience.

It is vital we ask for sharp discernment in order to recognize where the anointing of Christ is. Then we'll know it is HIS work, and not our own. You may email me for his P.O. box if you are interested in writing him. Sincerely, Theresa

-- Theresa Huether (Rodntee4Jesus@aol.com), November 11, 2002.

Dear Charlotte, amazingly we wrote at the same time again! And, double amazingly, I had the SAME question for John.. John, did I miss something? Have you been appointed our new Moderator?

Charlotte, forgive my presumptuousness. I don't pretend to have alot of expertise on this subject, I'm just covering some bases. Thank you for your post. I don't have time to digest it all at the moment. God bless you, Theresa

-- Theresa Huether (Rodntee4Jesus@aol.com), November 11, 2002.

Hello, Theresa,

{Dear Charlotte, amazingly we wrote at the same time again!}

We do seem to do that a great deal, don't we? LOL!!!

{John, did I miss something? Have you been appointed our new Moderator?}

Theresa, I'm not sure if John is a moderator. His posting to me came across as though he might be with his concerns regarding my original postings, as well as my sincerity. Possibly he was concerned that I might be a charlaton? (Well...my name IS Charlotte--bad humor...sorry!) There seem to be quite a few on forums and lists.

{You may email me for his P.O. box if you are interested in writing him.}

Yes! I'd love that. Thank you so much for your kindness.

{I suggest, to alleviate some frustration, that you continue to give this all back to the Lord,r e-submit it.}

Amen to that!

{I don't think you can get on a forum and expect to receive a certain immediate response.}

No, true enough. But one can hope. Thankfully, there is a forum that is specifically for spiritual warfare; I am in contact with the individual there. However, he is in the process of redesigning his Web site, and his forum and chat room are not presently available.

{Unless people are called, and have previous experience and teaching in spiritual warfare, preferably from a priest, you will encounter those who are totally disoriented from it, and even resistant to it.}

That is very true. But my hope is still to attempt to facilite and educate.

{When the Lord shows us things, He usually leads us by the hand, and puts the proper authority in our lives, and shows us in the proper order how to proceed.}

I expect that the Lord will make all known to me in His time. He is so good to us...He indeed leads me every day. I cannot do anything unless I do it with Him who guides me. I pray about everything--down to the tiniest details in my life.

{To be involved in healing and deliverance ministry is to be involved in a life-style, in a Christ-like mindset... People in the ministry I've met did not seek it out, quite contrarily, most say, 'no Lord, not me'.}

This is VERY true. Neither did I seek it out. Through a process of years, the Lord led me to this ministry. I'd have to say that deliverance of evil spirits is absolutely no picnic. It can be very scary. But the Lord grants each person in every ministry of His with the special graces they need to do His works.

{...[W]e've been blest with many new Catholic prayer communities being set up, with intercession as their focus. It is from these communities, and the powerful prophetic prayer being raised up, that healing ministries are being developed and sent out. We cannot act on our own.}

Yes...we also have a good healing ministry, with lots of folks for intercessory prayer which is invaluable. One of the priests active in our community was the Director of the Diocesan Charismatic Renewal Office. He has been my main spiritual director.

{I have a question regarding the individual that came to your parish and your pastor. What was the initial fruit of the visit?}

The individual who taught the group of folks who had been active in the healing ministry attended Cornell University and Fordham in New York. She has been active since I was a girl. She works with the priests and laity from the Institute of Christian Counseling and Therapy in Pennsylvania. She travels, and has an active ministry from New York City to Upstate New York.

The fruit from this lady's training was that several communities were set up from Ithaca (by Cornell) to Newark Valley and beyond. As I previously mentioned, all this has been over a course of several years--from 1983 to the present.

{Fr. Peter Sanders and team will not be doing the Institute in 2003, he is concentrating on writing, and doing workshops on the development of the charisms of the Holy Spirit. I believe his book will have much of the material from the institute in it.}

I would love to have a copy of his book. I do greatly appreciate your sharing it with me.

{He uses the Catechism of the Catholic Church superbly and highlights its beauty and splendor and depth.}

God bless him! The CCC is a treasure to us. I use it frequently-- especially in my writings.

{He exhorts us to check our motives, and calls us to a life of prayer and obedience.}

He is very wise. Without prayer we can never know what the Lord's true will is in our lives. Obedience is becoming such a rarity among Catholics. It's sad when Catholics fail to see how crucial obedience is in our spiritual growth.

Theresa, it sounds like you have a well-grounded Faith and a fertile spiritual growth. God bless you! It is such a blessing to get to know other good Catholics. As I have already mentioned to John, although my husband is still able to be physically active in the ministry, I am not. However, I am able to write and to facilitate to those who have no idea where they may turn to for healing, inner-healing and deliverance. The Lord certainly brings us to surprisingly different places in our lives than what we might have guessed. But He always guides, as well as granting us each and every grace we need to do His work.

Thanks so much for your words of inspiration, Theresa. I'd truly love to hear more about your own ministry and community. May the Good Lord bless you and yours abundantly, and may Our Lady keep you always safe beneath Her mantle.

-- Charlotte (rosaryqueen@clarityconnect.com), November 11, 2002.

Now I am confused! Why did my paragraph returns work this time and not before? I do wish one of you would educate me as to what I am doing right and wrong with my postings. Maybe I should use a text editor and split the sentences? Argh...code is different for every forum. *Sigh* I shall do my best. God bless!

-- Charlotte (rosaryqueen@clarityconnect.com), November 11, 2002.

^

-- ^ (^@^.^), November 11, 2002.

Dear Charlotte, our conversations led me to go through my notes from the healing institute with Fr. Sanders. I'm reminded of the original reason he didn't have the sessions taped. We spent the first hour in praparation for what the Holy Spirit would reveal. This was done through extended praise and worship. This praise and worship was an integral part of the institute, opening us up to the Holy Spirit.

We come to these events, as we so often come even to Mass, with a million things on our minds, and the weight of the world on our shoulders. It is vital in order to receive what the Lord has for us, that we strip ourselves of our agenda, our wills, and be open to Him. Sometimes this takes only a few minutes, sometimes it takes an hour or more. Never the less, the more time we give to Him in preparation by public praise and worship, the more disposed we become to the truth.

The sessions were usually more then just receiving teachings, they were to be experiencial and active. The tapes he offers are separate teachings. My prayers are with you, Theresa

-- Theresa Huether (Rodntee4Jesus@aol.com), November 17, 2002.