My husband and I decided to move to Houston together (this past summer) from Gainesville, FL after we graduated from college. At the time we were engaged, but obviously, not married. Circumstances wouldn't allow (mostly money) us to live separately so we decided that we would get married by the justice of the peace and live together. We both are Catholic and have always wanted a Catholic wedding. Our families and friends, as well, would like to celebrate our marriage with us. What our are options as far as ceremonies within the church? Can we still have a marriage ceremony?

-- Stacey Vigil (stacey_vigil@hotmail.com), January 30, 2003

Answers

Dear Stacey,

Not only may you have a Catholic wedding, but from the Church's viewpoint you must have a Catholic wedding, since in the eyes of the Church you are not currently validly married.

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), January 30, 2003.

That's not quite true. The Church recognizes civil weddings as being part of the law of the land. You are legally married. If the Church didn't recognize other marriages as being legally binding, there would be a lot of problems. It isn't for nothing that part of the ceremony (at least in all the Catholic weddings I've been to) is "and by the power vested in me by the state of (any of the 50)" or words to that effect. That is the same with other religious weddings. The Church recognizes it as valid, just doesn't say it is a Catholic marriage, because it wasn't performed in a Catholic Church.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), January 30, 2003.

If the church says a marriage is valid it means valid in the eyes of the church. The church has nothing to say about legality of civil marriages. So much for the GT's note. Stacey, go your local pastor he will be (he should be!) happy to make your marriage "valid"! There is no problem at all in it - you'll see. You can have all the glory in a catholic ceremony you want...

-- (marios85ten@hotmail.com), January 30, 2003.

It's true the Catholic Church doesn't pronounce on whether or not a marriage is "legal" but she certainly reserves the right to determine whether or not it's valid, i.e., a sacramental marriage. But Mario is right about going to your priest - he's the one who can fix it for you. :-)

-- Christine L. :-) (christine_lehman@hotmail.com), January 30, 2003.

The Church recognizes "other marriages" among "other people" as valid. It does not recognize "other marriages" between Catholics as valid.

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), January 30, 2003.

Mario, I said exactly what you are saying - that validity is not the same as legality. I would appreciate it if you would stop attacking me. Thank you.

-- Christine L :-) (christine_lehman@hotmail.com), January 31, 2003.

Did not mean to disturb a hornet's nest! :-)

"Valid" can mean many things, like legal. I bring that up because if you are already legally married (no problems like underage, unlicensed minister, etc.), you cannot get married in the Catholic Church if you were married to someone else first unless you go through not only a divorce but an annulment as well. Also, in the original question, you are in fact married, so it is not like the Catholic ceremony after the fact will change WHEN you were married--it will not erase the civil marriage. So I was thinking that probably you might have the marriage blessed instead, that's all.

Best wishes to you both.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), January 31, 2003.

GT, in the canon law, valid doesn't mean "many things" - and doesn't mean legal!

-- (marios85ten@hotmail.com), January 31, 2003.

I never said the Church pronounces marriages to be legal or not, but recognizes that other marriages performed either civilly or in other denominations/religions as "valid" in the sense of "are you married, yes or no?". As in, a marriage in one state is held to be a marriage in any other state.

Stacey is already married, you cannot turn back the clock as if the marriage had not taken place. You probably can have a Catholic wedding if you wish. But everyone already knows you're married, so.... (I'm using "you" in the "you all" sense here)....

I guess I'm one of those people who think that the wedding is just one day, the wedding, it is the rest of the marriage, day by day, that is more important.

Just my $0.02. Not to dissuade Stacey in the least.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), January 31, 2003.

Um, Mario, you seem to be new to the Forum. Please refrain from personal attacks on me, okay? Thanks.

-- Christine L :-) (christine_lehman@hotmail.com), January 31, 2003.

I have never, ever, heard any priest pronounce on the "validity" of Catholic marriages over others, and they certainly don't go around telling legally married folk that they are not married.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), February 01, 2003.

No-one is claiming that Catholic marriages are "more valid" than other marriages. The Church recognizes the validity of marriages between Protestants, Jews, and others. The original question was whether a marriage between two Catholics in front of a Justice of the Peace is a valid marriage. It is not! Such a marriage is null, de facto, by virtue of an extreme violation of canonical form. Such a "marriage" cannot be "validated" by the Church, as there is no marriage to validate. Such a couple would need to receive the sacrament of matrimony - in other words, they would need to marry.

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), February 01, 2003.

Once again, the moderator deleted answers of the people he doesn't like. I always appreciated comments from Marios but not to let him defend himself against the ignorance of others it's too much. No wonder he deleted a part of his answers - the moderator himself was involved in the ignorant posts...

-- (Alter17@river.stream), February 02, 2003.

If the moderator deleted the posts it is because Marios was obviously an intelligent priest (i suppose because of the canon law knowledge he had). His place was not on this forum!

-- (Loewitz9n@wt.net), February 02, 2003.

Paul, I agree that they did not have a Catholic wedding. I don't know that it is such a very awful thing, as long as they are living up to their marriage vows. As I said, it has never come up as a sermon topic during Mass or anything, canon law or no. And I doubt that any priest would say that someone married by a justice of the peace was "living in sin".

So I am confused when people taking what are pretty much standard marriage vows, regardless of who is officiating, are considered to be "not married". They are "not sacramentally married", or "not married in the Catholic Church", but they are married nonetheless, as the word is generally understood.

Perhaps if the Church were not so difficult with mundane issues about getting married within the church building (MUST be registered in that parish, MUST go to classes, etc.), maybe more people would get married within the Church. I am not averse to couples sitting down and having a chat with someone about some things to think about when you get married, but people didn't go to classes in the old days and managed to stay married just fine. Also, parents used to be a bigger influence on that sort of behavior, and they should step up to the plate and take on that responsibility again.

If you just want to have the priest and two witnesses, you should be able to, and outside as well. I know a lot of people who hear "Catholic Wedding", and think it HAS to be a big expensive evolution (clothes, 20 attendants, etc., etc.), so they shy away.

This discussion reminds me of the whole annullment discussion, for some reason.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), February 02, 2003.

Hi Stacey, I can totally understand your situation. My husband Stan and I also moved away and because of finances moved in together. We both have children from previous marriages (mine was annulled) and we felt it was best to set a good example for our children by being married, even if only in the eyes of the law so in a small intimate cereomy 1 1/2 years ago we were married by his aunt who is a notary. I am a confirmed Catholic, however Stan has only been baptized, but in the eyes of the church he is still Catholic, just not a confirmed Catholic, and therefore he can't take communion. Last August we moved back home and back to my hometown parrish where I was baptized and confirmed. Stan and I are now going through the process to get our marriage validated and blessed in the eyes of the church. We did not have a catholic marriage in the first place because my husband had also been married prior, but not in a Catholic church. I didn't realize at the time how simple it would have been to get that taken care of. It a matter of a piece of paper and three weeks. Since we were away from home and in an unfamiliar church I never really checked into it. My cousin is the priest at the parrish where we attend Mass. On Valentines Day '03 we met with him and he helped us to understand the Canon Law.

He also explained that normally in a wedding celebrating the sacrement of Marriage he wears two hats one of the law and one of the church. Because Stan and I are already legally married in our ceremony he will only wear the hat of the church.

It is best to talk to the priest at your church and he can walk you through the steps. One thing to keep in mind, I was told that until Stan and I recieve the sacrement of marriage I should not take communion. Since we did not follow canon law I am not practicing the teachings of the church. Once we have our vows validated I can again recieve communion.

So the sooner the better because there is still some counciling and a waiting period you will need to go through just as you would have, had you had a Catholic Wedding in the first place.

Hope this helps.

Dianne

-- Dianne Currie (standiann@aol.com), February 17, 2003.

This is actually another question related to the thread topic. If I were married say in Vegas, but wanted to have my marriage blessed by the Catholic church, do I need to go through a complete ceremony? Or is there a ceremony specifically for a marriage blessing. To simplify, kind of an "It's okay with the church that you're married and the church will recognize you." That sounds like of callous, but it's the jist of what I'm talking about.

I am Catholic and my fiance was baptized. My mom is the Director of Religous Ed. at our church and my entire family has been married in the church, making me the black sheep if I were to jump the gun and elope. My fiance and I have been living together for about 5 years (which is already one strike against us as far as the church is concerned), and we were engaged last year. My fiance isn't so much against a church ceremony, it's just that there is a lot of cost, etc. associated with a whole wedding/reception event and we are trying to grow our small business. I recently moved to NC and my whole family is in Michigan. My fiance and I are planning a trip to Vegas with friends in May, and though I am not planning to marry that weekend, if I do, is there a way to have our marriage blessed by the church later on without having to go through a traditional mass ceremony? I should ask my Mom about this, but I think she'd get suspicious! haha.. Thanks in advance for your help!!

-- Elizabeth Seales (e_seales@yahoo.com), February 27, 2003.

Elizabeth,

My husband and I are both "cradle Catholics" who hadn't attended mass since we were children, so when we got married, we didn't see the need to get married in the Catholic church. Well, now I am going through RCIA to get confirmed and take my first communion, and now desire to have my marriage blessed by the Church. So I have inquired alot about this topic at my parish. My advice to you would be, get married in the Church first, if at all possible. You can have a simple ceremony, you don't need to have a big ceremony with lots of attendents and a large reception. That being said, if you don't marry in the Church, you can have your blessed without having a "regular" ceremony, which is what my husband and I are going to do. From what I understand, the "blessing" ceremony can be as elaborate or as simple as you desire. My husband and I already had our wedding, and do not want to have another one, so at the ceremony it will be just the priest, us, and our two witnesses. Hope this information helps!

-- Amy (amy20013@hotmail.com), February 27, 2003.