Did Christ know Buddha?greenspun.com : LUSENET : Catholic : One Thread |
Let me say I am not a practicing Catholic although my parents are. I would like cross-examination to a long-term discussion I have with my common law wife who is Japanese and Zen Buddhist. I have 2 wonderful daughters from our union and here is the question. I would like to have a Church wedding and convince her to in part accept Christianity, obviously culture play’s a big part.We met in University and went through the difficult parent issue. Both of us work and every year we both vacate to her parents in a small town outside Tokyo.
She see’s the beauty, peace, hope and love that Christianity offers. She believes also Christ can be the Alpha & Omega. She also believes that there is no one after him, he is final and that his word is final. However my wife always comes back to the beginning “did Christ know Buddha”. In part it is the respect issue that Japanese hold so highly and in part respect to her parents and her ancestors. Her point is simple the Buddhist faith is 5 thousand years, solid in Japan and elsewhere and growing.
What she wants clarified is if Christ is the absolute why did he not mention her faith?
-- terence (nevgevenyt@lasvegasstock.com), March 22, 2003
This is a very good question, and I am certainly not qualified to give you a scholarly answer.I can only respond that there are many ancient religions, older than Christianity. Man has always searched for God! God placed something within us (His creatures), a yearning to know Him (Our Creator)...As St. Augustine says, "Our hearts are restless, Lord, until they rest in Thee!"
God revealed Himself in a very personal way to Abraham, the father of the Jewish faith. Throughout the generations that followed, God revealed more and more of himself, and promised to redeem His people, the Jews (and indeed, all of mankind) with a promised Messiah, or "Savior."
The Scriptures tell us that in the fullness of time, the Word (Jesus) became man, and In the beginning was the Word; the Word was in God's presence, and the Word was God. He was present to God in the beginning. Through him all things came into being and apart from him nothing came to be. Whatever came to be in him, found life, life for the light of men. The light shines on in darkness, a darkness that did not overcome it.
While the world was filled with the darkness of not knowing the True God, still, man yearned to know Him. But God always knew man, for He created man. And in the fullness of time, God sent His Only Son to become man.
So, I think it may safe for you to say, "Yes, Jesus knew Buddah," (for God is All-Knowing!) but it would not be true to say that Jesus regarded Buddah as God, or as Divine, since it is Jesus Christ Who is the Divine Son of the One True Triune God: Father, Son, and Holy Ghost.
Since Christ came as the Messiah of the Jewish people, to whom God had promised a Savior, He primarily addressed the Jews. But He also revealed Himself to the Samaritan woman, and even healed the daughter of a woman of another faith.
He did not mention the Buddhist religion by name, nor did he mention by name Hindu, etc. Yet the Church teaches that He came to save all men, if only they will believe in Him.
I hope this helps in some small way.
Pax Christi.
-- Anna <>< (flower@youknow.com), March 22, 2003.
Jmj
Hello, Terence.If I could speak to the woman you love, I would tell her these things:
1. If you could meet Jesus and ask him about Buddhism, he would tell you, "Before the Buddha came to be, I AM."
[Perhaps, Terence, you recognize this as a paraphrase of what Jesus told some of the Jewish people about Abraham. This was a way of declaring his divinity.]2. Jesus is the eternal Son of God. He never had a beginning. He observed the very conception of the Buddha. He watched as Buddhism came into being.
3. There is a disagreement, in various circles, as to whether Buddhism is a system of philosophy (in which many are atheists) or a true religion (in which people worship a god). Well, insofar as Buddhism touches on religious doctrines, we can say this: Every religious truth that exists in Buddhism exists also in Catholicism. [Conversely, if Buddhism makes a religious claim that contradicts Catholicism, one can know that it is an error, because Catholicism possesses the fullness of truth, with no error mixed in.]
4. Though chronologically older than Catholicism, Buddhism was begun by a man, while Catholicism was begun by God (Jesus).
5. The roots of Catholicism are in Judaism [the religion practiced by Jesus], and Judaism is really the world's original religion -- the worship given to God by the first humans created. Any other religion, including Buddhism, is much "younger."
6. Please read an outline of the history of the Catholic Church in Japan on the following pages:
http://www.pa uline.or.jp/history/e-history01.html
http://www.pa uline.or.jp/history/e-history02.html
http://www.pa uline.or.jp/history/e-history03.html
http://www.pa uline.or.jp/history/e-history04.html
http://www.pauline.or.jp/history/e-index.html7. Please read the stirring narratives of some of the great Catholic martyrs of 17th-century Japan (especially in Nagasaki), many of whom underwent incredible tortures, followed by beheading, burning, or crucifixion.
8. Please find out about the 20th-century appearances of Mary, the mother of Jesus, in Akita, Japan.
9. When next in Tokyo, go to visit the Catholic religious sisters known as the Daughters of St. Paul. They can even be phoned, or contacted by e-mail, from here in the U.S.. They are media experts who run shops that sell Catholic books and tapes (many of which they publish/record themselves).
You can "meet" the 36 sisters by name here. I am sure that many of them (perhaps all of them) know a great deal about Buddhism and would be much better to talk to than myself. Some probably were Buddhists before becoming Catholic.
Daughters of St. Paul
12-42, Akasaka 8 Chome Minato-Ku Tokyo 107-0052 Japan
Telephone = 81-3-3479-3943 Fax = 81-3-5474-7494
laudate@pauline.or.jp
God bless you.
John
-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), March 22, 2003.
With many cultures and religions Christ is acknowledged as a Prophet. He - Christ - is the ONLY " prophet " to have stated - I am From The Father - which is a statement I am God Alpha/Omega.Buddhist belief to my scant knowledge is that there is no afterlife - rather a continuence spiritual development. We as followers of Christ are at peace we hope in the knowledge we are unique individuals made in His image.
-- jean bouchard (jeanb@cwk.imag.net), March 22, 2003.
A very interesting and helpful little book is "The Lotus and the Cross: Jesus Talks With Buddha" by Ravi Zacharias. It reveals, through the format of an informal conversation between Jesus and Buddha, some of the fundamental differences between Christianity and Buddhism, and their respective world views.
-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), March 22, 2003.
Terrance I guess it all comes down to your defintion of what is solid. Aethism is also "5 thousand years old" "solid" and "growing" in every Western country. John has given you an excellent summary on the relationship between the truth and the Buddhist faith. I would only like to add a few words from Pope John Paul II. I would like to stress Terrance that while it would be nice to concentrate on what Buddhists and Catholics have in common it is perhaps more helpful to reveal the weaknesses of your wifes belief system."The Buddhist doctrine of salvation constitutes the central point, or rather the only point, of this system. Nevertheless, both the Buddhist tradition and the methods deriving from it have an almost exclusively negative soteriology.
The "enlightenment" experienced by Buddha comes down to the conviction that the world is bad, that it is the source of evil and of suffering for man. To liberate oneself from this evil, one must free oneself from this world, necessitating a break with the ties that join us to external reality-ties existing in our human nature, in our psyche, in our bodies. The more we are liberated from these ties, the more we become indifferent to what is in the world, and the more we are freed from suffering, from the evil that has its source in the world.
Do we draw near to God in this way? This is not mentioned in the "enlightenment" conveyed by Buddha. Buddhism is in large measure an "atheistic" system. We do not free ourselves from evil through the good which comes from God; we liberate ourselves only through detachment from the world, which is bad. The fullness of such a detachment is not union with God, but what is called nirvana, a state of perfect indifference with regard to the world. To save oneself means, above all, to free oneself from evil by becoming indifferent to the world, which is the source of evil. This is the culmination of the spiritual process."
God Bless
-- Kiwi (csisherwood@hotmail.com), March 22, 2003.
I have something to say about Buddhism.Buddhism is on the rise here in Brazil. Many intelligent people are reading the Dalai Lama books. They like them very much.
BUT!
It is interesting (or, better said, sad) that the things they like most in his books are those things that are basic Catholic truths (the need for compassion, equilibrium, detachment to material goods and so on). They seem to never have been taught that our Church teaches the same things. They find it an immense novelty. I use to say to these people that Buddhism (what it has of truth) stops where our Faith begins. That the detachment of this world, in our Faith, is followed by the filing of the soul with God’s Love. That the soul is not a place for vacuum, which is what Nirvana is all about.
What is most sad about this is that all of these people were baptized as Catholics. Most went into at least First Communion. How can they be so ignorant about our Faith?
Clearly, we are doing something very wrong in our Catechetics.
God Bless!
-- Atila (me@somewhere.com), March 22, 2003.
Atila - Living here in Canada I have read in South America there is a great surge of Catholics leaving the Church and going to alternate Protestant religions. Is this true from you viewpoint?
-- jean bouchard (jeanb@cwk.imag.net), March 22, 2003.
Unfortunately this is true.They are most (although not all) poor and ignorant people, from the lower economic classes, many of whom illiterate. They have been going to new Pentecostal Churches. “Give me your money and I will oust from you the Devil, he is who is not letting you get a job / stop drinking / earning more little money” You know the line. It’s called “Theology of Prosperity”, loosely based on Calvinism.
The fact that our Church here focuses way too much on economic issues and sometimes forgets to preach Christ certainly has something to do with this.
But the current growth of the Charismatic Renewal is somehow checking that tide, thank God!
God Bless!
-- Atila (me@somewhere.com), March 22, 2003.
Atila - Thank you responding.
-- jean bouchard (jeanb@cwk.imag.net), March 23, 2003.
It is interesting to see Terence that even though Jesus never met Budha in Person there are similarities. In addition to what John, Anna and Paul had to say, this is what I see.Jesus as a jew already had the tradition of God appearing to Abraham, Jacob, Moses, Isaiah... When Jesus is baptized a voice says that Jesus is his son. Jesus begins his ministry choosing disciples. His discipples carry only the bare necessities of life. Later, as the Church grew, many believed that by denying the world, they could find God. This gave rise to monasticism, which still has lasted to our days.
The Budha seemed to have a revelation (dream while under the tree). I don't doubt chose this man to preach to his own people. I have always believed that God knows what he does. He chooses the right people for the right job. As a Hindu, Budha was able to communicate with his people. He saw what was wrong in Hinduism and try to reform it. His followers spread his message. With time, what was said by the master could be adapted in such a way that many of the things Budha believd are no linger believed by his people. Yet, the idea of denial is very similar to monasticism. The use of rosary beads lets me to guess that Budhism has influenced that aspect into the catholic belief of the Rosary. Just like in Budhism, the Catholic mantra is a our father followed by 10 Hail Maries/ Holy Maries.
So there is a lot of sincretism between Catholicism and Budhism.
-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonzalez@srla.org), April 02, 2003.