If I am agnostic and my future husband is Catholic, is the baptism of our child in a catholic church a possibility even though I will not raise my child to believe Christianity is the one true faith?

-- Kristy Bale (kristybale@msn.com), June 12, 2003

Answers

Jmj

Kristy, are you aware of the fact that your fiance needs his bishop's special permission to marry a non-Catholic?
Further, are you aware that, in order to obtain this permission, he must promise his pastor that he will not leave the Church and that he will do everything in his power to raise your children as Catholics?

If you intend to do what you can to prevent his raising the children as Catholics, then I urge you not to get married, because your conflict on this matter could be a recipe for disaster.
However, if you will not interfere with your husband's raising the children as Catholics, then I'm sure that the priest would baptize them.

May God bless you (even if you're not sure he exists)!
John

-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), June 12, 2003.

J.F. - A promise to a bishop seems to be a weak idea seeing as promises to the Catholic church are continuously being broken.

Telling Ms. Bale to avoid marriage is simply none of your business and suggests that a Catholic and non-Catholic would be unable to compromise.

Also, it is not a sin, illegal or wrong to disagree with the Catholic religion. Therefore, no person should be required to receive special permission from a bishop, priest or the like for simply wishing to solidify a bond of love in marriage. If one half of the couple is not Catholic it should not be a problem. The mere fact that the non-Catholic is willing to sacrifice his/her own beliefs to appease those of their partner should be enough to allow the marriage to occur. It is the existence of all these rules and hurdles that people have to go through that turns them sour against the Catholic church. In my opinion, I don't think that allowing a non-Catholic to wed in a Catholic church is going to taint or ruin the church...at least not anymore than it already is.

-- Donna Callagain (DanieRie23@hotmail.com), June 12, 2003.

Dear Kristy,

We are all free persons in this world, and we can all decide for ourselves. We can choose what is right, or what is wrong. That is our God-given freedom, and we will each live with the results, both temporal and eternal, of what we choose.

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), June 12, 2003.

Jmj
Hello, Donna.

You wrote:
"Telling Ms. Bale to avoid marriage is simply none of your business and suggests that a Catholic and non-Catholic would be unable to compromise."

You are mistaken. She aired her personal concerns in public, and I am a Catholic who is trying to help her and her friend. These two facts make it my "business" to warn them to avoid marriage if they are in conflict about how to raise their children. I care about them, the children, and the Church. I would be wrong to keep silent.
If anyone is speaking out of turn, it is you, Donna. But I forgive you, because I suspect that your emotional reaction arises out of suffering through something similar in your own life. [The only other explanation I can think of for your opposing me so strongly and unjustifiably is that you may be an anti-Catholic bigot.]

God bless you.
John

-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), June 12, 2003.

A promise is a promise. This is a promise that you will make before God and man. Be careful though. You can be denied the right to marry in the Church if you do not promise this or if you intend to break the promise.

-- Scott (papasquat10@hotmail.com), June 15, 2003.

Hello John,

Now that you're being accused of saying something that is "none of your business", you say the same things I did to defend my self. What a hypocrit you are. However, she didn't say that it wasn't any of your business to post an answer (if you would read carefully), but what she did say that it's not any of your business to tell people who they should and should not marry. I think Donna really points out what taints the Catholic church and why people have a problem with it.

-- Grant (abc@defg.com), July 07, 2003.

kristy:

1 why are you bothering to baptise the child if you know in advance that the ceremony is pointless??

2 and why do you feel that you are entitled to abuse the Sacrament that we hold so very dear, when - so far as i am aware - we Catholics have done nothing to offend you??

3 and how do you know that you will have children?!? is this a shotgun wedding?!? or are you being presumptuous??

of course, it would be great if the kid was baptised and brought up in the Church to the point where - even if you are of the view that it is a waste of time - at least yr kid gets the opprotunity to decide for himself.

so go for it Kirsty, but do it properly. and the very best of health to your kids. God loves them even if you do not love God. that's guaranteed.

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), July 08, 2003.

Jmj

Grant, life is too short for me to waste time replying substantively to anti-Catholic bigots like you -- a person who continues to nurse a grudge after being corrected a few months ago. (Matthew 7:6 [Jesus said,] "Do not give dogs what is holy; and do not throw your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under foot and turn to attack you.")

I could pick apart the errors in your message, Grant, but I'll bypass them, because I don't recognize you as a viable participant in this forum. While you may not yet have been explicitly banned by the moderator, I consider you banned. Take your poison elsewhere. I don't care if you "have a problem with" the Catholic Church. That is your failing, not mine nor the Church's.

May God help you.
John

-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), July 09, 2003.

John

It's obvious to me that you hate everybody who is not Catholic. Anything they say you disagree with and you attack them personally by they're beliefs and by tellint them how they should run their lives. (telling people they should not marry, etc.)

Concerning the grudge we had a while back didn't have any relavance to what I had said to you. But as long as it is brought up, let me say that I didn't realize that I used that word in the sentence. I'm sorry that it may have confused a person or two. However, YOU did know what I had meant to say in the sentence, you even admitted it, but you continued to use the context against me even though you had known what I was saying.

Now what did have relavance and what I found quite amusing was someone accusing you of something you accused me of. You used the same ideas to defend yourself as I had of myself, yet when I had defended myself, it wasn't good enough for you. That's what I found ironic.

John, I know we could bicker at each other for a long time and nobody would win. I so sorry that the moderator didn't think that my messages should be banned just because you're anti-protestant who don't agree with me. Maybe he thought that my difference of opinon would help people read, think about, and make their own decisions by themselves based upon the responses they got here, rather than an overwhelming onesided opionon. That's what some people come here for in the first place.

Well, that's nice that you don't care about my problems about the failing catholic church. I would think that you would.

May God someday enlighten you

-- Grant (GF@uhoo.com), July 09, 2003.

Jmj

Grant, you have just wasted another ten minutes on more garbage. This causes me to copy the words that I posted last time:

Life is too short for me to waste time replying substantively to anti-Catholic bigots like you -- a person who continues to nurse a grudge after being corrected a few months ago. (Matthew 7:6 [Jesus said,] "Do not give dogs what is holy; and do not throw your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under foot and turn to attack you.")

I could pick apart the errors in your message, Grant, but I'll bypass them, because I don't recognize you as a viable participant in this forum. While you may not yet have been explicitly banned by the moderator, I consider you banned. Take your poison elsewhere. I don't care if you "have a problem with" the Catholic Church. That is your failing, not mine nor the Church's.

May God help you.
John
PS: I'll illustrate very quickly how I could "pick apart the errors in your message". You wrote: "It's obvious to me that you hate everybody who is not Catholic." You're dead wrong, because I don't "hate" ANYbody, whether Catholic or "not Catholic". I only "hate" the bad things that people do, whether Catholic or "not Catholic." Give it up, Grant, for your case is hopeless.

-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), July 10, 2003.

Jeez John, I seemed to try to explain to you many times of how I was not anti-catholic or that I didn't hate anyone before but that seemed to fall upon deaf ears (or eyes in this case) and more false claims of how I was anti-catholic. John, those words I used in my last post was just as an example of how you accused me and other people. I don't actually think you hate anybody, but that was just an example of how foolish you sound when you talk and accuse people. And you responded just how I thought you would. That was the whole point of my comment to you. I hope you now know how it feels to be accused of something your not and would please stop with these accusations. Hopefully you've learned a lesson by this John.

Grant

-- Grant (GF@uhoo.com), July 10, 2003.

Forget it, Grant. You are trying to fool others who are not acquainted with you, but I won't let you. I could go back and find all your past posts to prove to any objective person what a dedicated anti-Catholic you are. But I wouldn't take the time to do that unless you really posed a threat here. Fortunately, you don't annoy the forum very often, so I won't have to bother with that unpleasant task.
John

-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), July 11, 2003.

John, you said to me, "You are trying to fool others who are not acquainted with you, but I won't let you." Well John, it seems to me that I am only talking to you directly so I don't know how I am trying to fool anyone else. All I was trying to get from you was maybe a little bit of an apology, but your one of those arrogant catholics that can't ever admit to being wrong. At least I can admit to being wrong or maybe handeling a situation I could have handled a little better. John, if you wanted, you can go right ahead and find all my "anit-catholic" statements. You won't find many if any and if I felt I said something I should have, I probably already said I didn't mean it or something to that extent. However, if I were to do the same check on you, I would have far more evidence against you. Maybe you should get off you high horse for once, fess up to your sins and be a man. Grant

-- Grant (grant@email.com), July 16, 2003.

"Well John, it seems to me that I am only talking to you directly so I don't know how I am trying to fool anyone else."
Wow! I'm surprised that you seem unaware that you are posting at a public forum, where dozens (if not hundreds) are reading your messages.

You've had the last word, Grant. Nothing can be gained by continuing.
JFG

-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), July 16, 2003.

I am so frightened by what i am reading - i came to this site to get an answer to a question but in stead see all this awful hatred, name calling, and falsehood about the Church. Is there anyone iwth authority on here that i might ask a question of? A Deacon, Priest, a theolgoian? Ms. Bale I am sorry that this is the answers you are receiving please do not believe that this is how Catholics act - Geez if i knew nothing of the religion and was asking questions like you are I don't think i would want my child raised this way. We are a warm loving Christian religion. Pls seek answers from elsewhere. Thanks!

-- JLB (janettebolton@aol.com), October 16, 2003.

Dear JLB,

There are a number of knowledgeable, mature, thoroughly orthodox Catholics here who can respond to most questions concerning the Catholic faith. As you have observed, there are also others who do not fit that description. Please feel free to ask your question, but you may have to separate the wheat from the chaff in considering the responses you receive. As forum moderator I try to delete posts that are hateful, outright foolish, utterly unrelated to the topic, or dangerously misleading on moral and doctrinal matters. But that still leaves a lot of room for expression of personal opinions which may or may not fully conform to Church teaching.

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), October 16, 2003.