The Catechism of the Catholic Church states that "Baptism is the first and chief sacrament of the forgiveness of sins".

If this is so, why did Christ come into this world as flesh and died on the cross for our sins?

-- Henri (kxhenri@yahoo.com), May 28, 2004

Answers

baptism into the Holy Christian church is the spiritual rebirth through water and spirit that Christ Himself calls for in the gospels. it is in that rebirth that we are born from sin into new life... it is for that very reason, that ability to be reborn into grace, that Christ died on the cross for our sins: so that we could be forgiven and be remade unto God.

The power to forgive sins, either through the baptismal rite, or through confession/penance stems directly from the fact that Christ died on the cross for us... they have no power to forgive in and of themselves, but gain the power to forgive THROUGH the actions of Christ on our behalf.

-- paul h (dontsendmemail@notanaddress.com), May 28, 2004.

Paul,

your response seems to be that there are more than one way to be forgiven of sin. Could you list them to me?

-- Henri (kxhenri@yahoo.com), May 28, 2004.

No! There is only ONE way we are able to enter into heaven, and it is ONLY BY THE BLOOD OF JESUS CHRIST.

You know, I was once very anti-Catholic, but now I am a Catholic. I was SURPRISED BY TRUTH you might say. Every single doctrine of the Catholic Church can be found (with overwhelming evidence) and grounded in the Bible. And faith ( which BTW is a work as well and God COMMANDS us to believe AND to repent, these are not options) is not just a mere belief in Christ as God and savior, but it is SURRENDERING OUR ENTIRE LIFE TO CHRIST! To follow Him! We are NOT saved by works, and the Catholic Church has ALWAYS taught that, why the myth persists I do not know, because with a little effort on studying past councils, the Catholic Catechism, and even the Bible will all show this.

-- Jason (Enchanted fire5@aol.com), May 28, 2004.

The basics of salvation can be easily found, or living the Christian life can even be found quite easily in the Bible. But Roman Catholicism is a complex system to understand, but as you begin to learn, you see the beauty in it, in God! C.S. Lewis (I forget the exact words) once said the same thing, comparing Christianity to a wooden desk as in..."You can easily explain what a wooden table is, but as you begin to break it down it will boggle the mind. Note, Lewis said it much better than I.

-- Jason (Enchanted fire5@aol.com), May 28, 2004.

We have already discussed the Biblical evidence for sacramental confession through the ministry of a priest. That is one means by which sins may be forgiven. Baptism is another way sins can be forgiven, as clearly described in passages such as ...

"Peter said to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit". (Acts 2:38)

"Now why do you delay? Get up and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on His name."(Acts 22;16)

When a baptized person receives instruction to enter the Catholic Church, he/she receives sacramental confession before receiving the Eucharist and the sacrament of Confirmation, so that these sacraments may be received worthily. However, when an unbaptized person enters the Church, he/she does not receive sacramental confession first. It is not necessary since his/her baptism itself will wash away all sin, just as the Bible states.

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), May 28, 2004.

If baptism is one way to cleanse sin and the only way to enter heaven, why did Jesus say to the one next to him on the cross that he will be with Jesus in paradise? He was not baptized.

-- Henri (kxiong@zksoft.us), May 28, 2004.

Henri, your thinking sounds like "If you are not baptized you cannot be forgiven, even though a new believer who now wants to follow Christ and be baptized, but, suddenly dies in a car accident, he obviously never got "saved" because he never "actualy" got baptized." If that's how you think, then that's not true, he would still be "saved" and if he had lived, he'd begin the Christian walk IF HE HAD SAVING FAITH (surrendering your heart ENTIRELY to God) Simular to confession, if one sincerely repented from their sins and were on their way to confession yet died, he'd still be forgiven by Christ's Blood.

Perhaps another could explain these things better than I, and if I am wrong, then my brothers and sisters, correct me.

-- Jason (Enchanted fire5@aol.com), May 28, 2004.

Henri,

what you speak of is called "baptism through desire." That is, if the man honestly would have returned to the church and gone to be baptised in the name of Christ had he gone on living, then he dies, he is judged to be baptised through his sincere desire to be in communion with God... essentially through his faith he is cleansed. I'm sure Paul M can make a better discussion of it than me.

-- paul h (dontsendmemail@notanaddress.com), May 29, 2004.

All,

if we are forgiven by Jesus's Blood, then baptism is not the only way to cleanse your sin. Jesus himself said the one of the thiefs on the cross that he will be with Jesus in paradise after he accepted Jesus Christ. Therefore, baptism cannot cleanse sin, but only Jesus's blood shed on the cross. Jesus himself baptism..so Jesus is a sinner?

-- Henri (kxhenri@yahoo.com), May 30, 2004.

The fact that baptism washes away sin does not automatically mean that one who receives baptism is a sinner. You can take an aspirin even if you don't have a headache. Jesus subjected Himself to baptism as an example to us, even though He personally had no need of it. Further, baptism does not cleanse us of sin apart from the blood of Christ. It is the grace of the cross which washes away sin through the waters of baptism. This clearly stated by Peter ...

"For Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, so that He might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit ...

Corresponding to that, BAPTISM NOW SAVES YOU - not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience -through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, who is at the right hand of God, having gone into heaven, after angels and authorities and powers had been subjected to Him." (1 Peter 18, 21-22)

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), May 30, 2004.