if i die tomorrow (and i hope to cos then i will see god earlyer) and i have never been to confesion in my life but i am a born again xtian and i have a relationship with god will i go to heaven? in your view that is....

-- kt (jc_died_4_me@hotmail.com), February 17, 2005

Answers

Katie,

Only God can answer that one.

But if you're asking if salvation is possible outside of the Catholic Church, then the answer is basically yes -- but it is much more difficult.

See http://www.catholic.com/library/Salvation_Outside_the_Church.asp

God bless,

- Sean

-- Sean Cummins (sean@scummins.com), February 17, 2005.

i am trying to say this with as mych grace as i can muster....

*graceface*

i have looked at the weblink (thanks for you help) and as far as i can see there are no BIBLE links... i really cannot see how belivers of jesus (and im not saying that i am more of a saint than you) can stray from his manual.

by the way i was typing that VERRRRRRRRRY slowly and full of grace... truthfuly! :)

cyber love to all of you!

XxX

-- kt (jc_died_4_me@hotmail.com), February 17, 2005.

Dear kt,
One of the hardest things a faithful Catholic has to tell ''born agains'' is--- The words ''Born Again'' are only correct as BAPTISM is received by a soul. If you were baptised, you were born again right there.

Unless you were baptised, you will never be born again. If you're baptised and in Christ's Church, you have everything necessary for gaining everlasting life. Because you have ALL the truth in that one Church. NOT what you find in a ''born again'' Bible readers' activity or community. These have NO authority or charism or power, to help you become ''born again.''

There you might learn a part of the truth. But in the Catholic faith you are given every truth ever taught by Jesus Christ. And every one of His teachings is absolutely important.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), February 17, 2005.

indeed it is the only type of xian posible ( i think peter mentions it)

i am not baptisted myself i am going to be very soon at my school (boarding skool) but i have been baptist by the holy spirit (i dont even know if i want to get into this right now but hey!) which has given my the gift of interpritaion of tounges (which i cant spell) and the gift its self

-- kt (jc_died_4_me@hotmail.com), February 17, 2005.

Katie,

If you are looking for some of the biblical evidence for the sacrament of confession, try the following link:

http://www.cathinsight.com/apologetics/forgive.htm

Hope that helps..

- Sean

-- Sean Cummins (sean@scummins.com), February 17, 2005.

No you haven't. You think you have. Read my message above. I told you the truth. I really hope it can do you some good. You seem a wonderful girl; so stay here. Learn about the true faith of the holy apostles. You are the descendent of faithful Catholics, in case no one's told you. They learned the faith from Christ's holy apostles; the same whom produced the Bible you believe in.

The Holy Bible speaks EXCLUSIVELY of the Catholic faith, kt. No other sect or denomination is ever found in your Bible, the New Testament.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), February 17, 2005.

Eugene,

She's like the gentile crowd that Peter preached to. As he preached, the Holy Spirit came upon them causing them to speak in other tongues. Peter then realized that the Holy Spirit had pretty much done the work and said they should now be baptized in water, and obviously no one can object since the Spirit has already shown His approval.

kt, there are several Spirit-Filled believers on this forum who function in various gifts of the Spirit, myself included. Understand that the Catholics represent one of the largest bodies of charismatics in the world. Estimates range from 40-60 million worldwide. And believe me, it's the same Holy Spirit working in them that is in you.

David

-- non-Catholic Christian (no@spam.com), February 17, 2005.

catholicism isn't the right form of christianity,jesus never told anyone to preach things that aren't in the scriptures...sorry but that's the truth

-- sdqa (sdqa@sdqa.Com), February 17, 2005.

Dear David:
This isn't at all what the apostles preached. Even YOUR ancestors were Catholics. The Holy Spirit isn't ''working'' anywhere. He abides with us as Christ promised. I do not concede you are ''Spirit- filled''. Please forgive my bluntness. There is only ONE Church founded by Christ and our head in this world is Peter, who has been succeeded faithfully by each Catholic bishop of Rome. You don't acknowledge Peter and his successor. Therefore you aren't a member of the One Church founded by Jesus Christ. Just come back; charisms and all. Then you'll truly be in the Holy Spirit.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), February 17, 2005.

“i have looked at the weblink (thanks for you help) and as far as i can see there are no BIBLE links... i really cannot see how belivers of jesus (and im not saying that i am more of a saint than you) can stray from his manual.” (kt) “jesus never told anyone to preach things that aren't in the scriptures...sorry but that's the truth” (sdqa)

1. Just because there are no bible links on that page doesn’t mean it “strays from” or contradicts the Bible. It doesn’t.

2. Please read this very carefully and slowly because a lot of otherwise fine Christians have a lot of trouble getting this simple fact into their heads: The bible is most emphatically NOT “His manual”. Christ never wrote a book, distributed a book, or even told His disciples to write a book. Of course "He never told anyone to preach things that aren’t in the scriptures", nor did He tell them to preach only things that (would later be) in the scriptures, because the Christian scriptures did not then exist. He founded the Church which over 300 years later, decided to authorise and publish a collection of some (not all) of the books and letters written by first-century bishops and priests. They wrote down some (not all) of the things which they had already been preaching. THE CHURCH MADE THE BIBLE. THE BIBLE DID NOT MAKE THE CHURCH. If it were possible for the Church to disappear, you would NOT be able to re-construct the Church using the Bible as a “manual”.

-- Steve (55555@aol.com), February 17, 2005.

BUT

i do as jesus did (or i try)

jesus never said "did you hear what the emperor said in his press release last week?"

no jesus only quoted from the TORRAH

-- kt (jc_died_4_me@hotmail.com), February 18, 2005.

KT-

Jesus also used a tremendous amount of parables. There is speculation about whether He heard those before, heard them and changed them, or invented them Himself. Either way, they are not to be found in the Old Testament. Therefore, he clearly uses oral tradition to teach. That is what we Catholics continue to do.

Catholic oral tradition predates the Bible. In fact the Church taught orally for its first 15 years, then the Epistles began to be written.

15 years!! Before any part of the current New Testament had been written. There is no way the earliest Christians were sola scriptura.

Tim Kirschenheiter

-- Tim K. (tk4386@juno.com), February 18, 2005.

yeah but i do not trust say the popes word but i will trust jesus' word because funnily enough jesus is the son of God an dthe pope isnt (yes he is adoipted but you know what i mean!)

-- kt (jc_died_4_me@hotmail.com), February 18, 2005.

but the early church needed to teach oral because there were no scriptures to rely on,but because we have scriptures now there is no need for oral teachings anymore...

about the catholic doctrines: where does jesus say that he allowed his apostels or his church to teach things which he didn't talk about?

-- sdqa (sdqa@sdqa.Com), February 18, 2005.

I would re-read Steve and Tim K's posts, both were very instructive about understanding how Catholic teaching has always relied on both the bible and tradition. You won't find everything in one or the other.

-- Jim (furst@flash.net), February 18, 2005.

“jesus only quoted from the TORRAH” The thing which set Jesus’ teaching apart from the teachiong of the other Jewish teachers of His time was that they confined themselves to saying "Scripture says X" or at most ‘Scripture says x, so I deduce Y”. Jesus taught from His OWN authority, not from scripture. That is what astonished and scandalized the scribes and pharisees. If you want to argue along that line then logically you should quote from and believe in ONLY in the Old Testament scripures which Jesus quoted, not the New Testament scriptures which were written by His disciples and by others who followed them.

“because we have scriptures now there is no need for oral teachings anymore” (sdqa) And how do you propose to resolve what the truth is when every protestant sect comes up with different and contradictory teachings, which they all claim derive from the Bible alone? “Authority” is a dirty word to some people, but authority is necessary, and God has not failed to provide us with an authority. It’s true that some Popes and bishops in the past were overly AUTHORITARIAN (exerting excessive or inappropriate authority over things they had no rightful authority over) , one of the factors which sparked the protestant rebellion. But if the Pope and bishops gave up their RIGHTFUL authority they would be failing to exercise the mission and duty which Christ gave them. He told them "PREACH the gospel to every creature". By "gospel" He didn't mean the books written later by Matthew, Mark, Luke and John, because they hadn't even been written yet.

“where does jesus say that he allowed his apostels or his church to teach things which he didn't talk about?” One example – “I will send you the Spirit of Truth, and He will lead you into all truth”. ALL truth, not just confined to what Jesus said. And certainly not confined to those relatively few words of Jesus which have passed down to us in writing. You could recite ALL of Jesus’ words in the Gospels within an hour or two. Don’t you think He had a LOT more to say to the Apostles in the three years He spent 24/7 with them?

-- Steve (55555@aol.com), February 19, 2005.

Steve,

"You could recite ALL of Jesus’ words in the Gospels within an hour or two. Don’t you think He had a LOT more to say to the Apostles in the three years He spent 24/7 with them?"

I never thought of it that way. That is very interesting.

I like it a lot.

Tim Kirschenheiter

-- Tim K. (tk4386@juno.com), February 19, 2005.